Starter Clutch Replacement

I don't know if someone has mentioned it already, but I very highly strongly recommend that you replace the starter chain guide while you're in there. Also, I recommend getting some plasti gauge and checking the shells. Can't hurt. I wish I did it, my bike started knocking while cold just a few months after I did the chain guide.

You will also want a good torque wrench, which I'm sure you know, and impact rated torx bits for the big 3. Get one of these if you don't already have an impact solution. http://www.sears.com/craftsman-impa...x26603657165&gclid=CP6WjI_3us4CFZSIaQod6WsBBA

Edit: oh shit this post is pages long. Carry on.

 

Ha ha, thanks anyway! I do have all that stuff, including the plastigage. I had to replace the main journal bearings.

 

He's using Locktite 518, so that's not an issue (though you don't want it getting into the bolt holes or it might set-up there and cause problems).

 

No problem on tbe question. I just wanted to make sure that you had all the info needed for reassembly and aren't just relying on what is intended to be a supplemental write-up.

 

So I should use Loctite 518 instead of 515? I have 515 on hand, I would have to order 518. I visited 2 auto shops around here and called a bunch as well as hardware stores, and no luck. Most don't even carry Loctite products, just Permatex, which seems odd.

 

Both 515 and 518 are suitable. No need to order anything different from what you have. Ignore my typo.

 

OK, great, thank you very much!

 

Man, all I can say is "F wet setting". Ha ha.

 

there's a shift fork that might need held up to catch a shaft, a helper comes in real handy for that

 

?
Sorry, my comment above was about the carbs, I actually got the bike all together except for the carbs, tank, and exhaust. I'm just waiting on the carbs before anything else can be completed, all the delay caused by my wet setting ineptitude is especially frustrating.

 

i was thinking that was just a statement about carbs in general

 

Finally got the bike outside. Got the engine back in, carbs done and everything back in. Turn the key, lights come on and everything! Hit the starter button aaand nothing. Grrr. Tried some starter fluid, nothing. So, it seems like the solenoid is bad, I can jump it and the starter turns, engine cranks, but does but start. I checked for spark by removing the plugs and I'm not getting anything there. Now the starter engages as soon as I jump the posts without input from the starter button. Looks like I'll be chasing electronic issues instead of syncing the carbs today....

 

Maybe it was the starter button, I sprayed that with brake cleaner and was eventually able to get the bike to start, haven't been able to keep the bike running long enough to do the synch though. It sounds like it's ruining fairly well, but starts walking down until it quits. The weights in the carbtune weren't moving at first, I finally got them to move at idle but it died and it looks like I ran the battery down enough that I'm going to have to wait a little while for it to charge back up.

Despite the frustrations it's great to see the bike back in front of the house, and I have had no leaks or anything(except for that bowl drain screw I forgot to tighten up after wet setting), so I'm calling it a win so far!

 

Ok, so I got the bike running, and started syncing, but there is some smoke coming from the head, and white exhaust from the mufflers, is that normal?

 

Sounds good.
It's sat for a while, accumulating dust and debris, and moisture in the exhaust. All that crap has to burn off.

 

Cool, thanks, now I just need to figure out how to adjust the clutch cable... No matter how many times I read the fitz and Rick write ups, I can seem to get the lever to return. I'm having my wife read it to see if she can explain it to me, ha ha.

 

I think I have to consider the fact that I may have made a mistake when assembling the clutch. My wife has tried futzing with it as well and we haven't been able to get it right.

Background: I have both the FSM and Haynes manual and had read both Fitz and Rick's articles. I put the plates in as described and torqued things down to spec, made sure the dots were aligned when putting the inner/outer basket together . I did reuse all of the old components. One thing I noted was that the push rod didn't seem to be very taught in there even after torquing everything, it hung loose a little bit. I noticed in Fitz's writeup that the flat spot on the push rod was facing parallel with the ground (or at least seemed to be), but I put mine facing down and toward the rear of the bike at a 45 degree angle from the ground (or my approximation at least) as I believe that is what the FSM recommends. Clutch cover went on without too much fuss.

Without the cable attached, the throw-out rod has about 90 degrees of movement (from memory). There is no resistance when turning this rod by hand until it stops fully at the clockwise position, except a negligible amount from the spring.

I am getting very little, if any, return on the clutch hand lever when I depress it. It just sort of flops around. I can tighten everything so that there is no free play/slack at the end of the cable, but since there is no tension on the rod, that means I can only squeeze the clutch lever in a few cms before coming to a full stop agains the end of the throw-out rods clockwise rotation.

Am I just being dense with the adjustment, or is it more likely I screwed up the installation?

FWIW I did keep the manuals in front of me while reinstalling everything and was looking at the parts diagrams to make sure I wasn't missing any pieces. I did try to move the bike across the street under its own power, just to see if the clutch worked at all. The clutch never engaged, even at the full clockwise stop. I could put it in gear (I don't have any problems shifting through all of them) but there was no change from neutral.

 

Are the lever and case marks aligned correctly? You should be able to push up or rotate CW to full stop and the lever mark should align with the case mark. From there adjust the cable for 2 to 3 mm free play.

But, this makes it sound more serious.

 

I'll have to check then, I did change its position a few times (in Rick's post he mentions moving it over a tooth or two to pick up slack).

 

The wife was able to check. The dots match up when resting in the counter clockwise position.

 

When you tighten the bolts on the basket the clutch should be engaged, no shifting until the arm moves cw.
Is this what you have?
The big fitz writeup would be for a 550.
Hate to ask but do you have the right number of plates?

 

They should align in the CW position or as you push up on the lever, so hopefully adjusting it will get you there.

Disconnect the cable, assemble the lever onto the shaft so that the alignment marks line up when the slack is removed by pushing up on the lever or rotating clockwise. This point should be a hard stop, the resistance of the smaller spring can be ignored. You will not be able to push it any further by hand because of the force required to operate the clutch and the lack of mechanical advantage provided by the clutch lever.

Install the cable, adjust the handle lever adjuster to near mid-range.

Adjust the cable length adjuster at the bottom so that you have approximately 2 to 3 mm of free play at the handle lever.

Any fine adjustment or future adjustments can be done with the handle lever adjustment.

 

I put all the plates that I had back into the basket, so I hope so! It was also full, so I believe I'm good there. I made sure I started and ended with a friction plate as well. I stored it together so I knew how it went back together, plus I took lots of pictures. The only time they were separated was when I soaked the pressure plates in oil before installing them.

 

I will try to make the adjustments with the lever and rod as you outline, hopefully that is all that I need.

 

this is the important part
when you tighten the bolts on the basket, you compress the springs, that squeezes the plates together.

this tells me the plates are not squeezed and all the adjustment in the world won't help.
i think if you go back to the beginning you're going to find the problem. the larger outside part should connect to the engine and the shaft to the transmission

 

That sounds like it is it. I didn't compress the plates at all, just but the bolts in and tightened to spec. So should I be pushing down on them while torquing?

 

That did it! I don't know what I did differently than last time but it's working now. Thanks! Tomorrow we ride(hopefully)!

 

make dam sure it's right, this lasted 15 miles, then poof, could have been ugly

 

Yikes! With my wife as my witness, I followed the manuals exactly. I read both out loud and pointed to what I was doing, ha ha. Do you know what happened?

 

Ran the pressure plate bolts in till they touched, went and had dinner, came back and put the cover on and never tightened the bolts.
Oops

 

That sucks! I was concerned about stuff like that happening with this job since it has taken me almost 8 months to do. I tried not to start anything that I thought I couldn't finish in that sitting, which of course contributed to how long it took me to do. I still find plenty of other ways to do stupid crap though. There were only two things here that I could think of that may have caused the issue. When I took off the pressure plate, and all the ones beneath, there was a friction plate that was about half an inch or so from the steel plate behind it and kind of stuck half cockeyed. I couldn't tell if that was like that when I installed everything, or if it happened while I was taking the pressure plate off. The other thing I did was to change the angle of the push rod down a little bit more. I thought I had it around 45 degrees last time, but this time I held up the book to the clutch and tried to match it as exactly as I could. I was able to ride across the street last night, but I don't think the clutch is quite fully disengaging so I have a little more adjusting to do.

 

That time I got up early, put the cases together and rode it that evening, well 15 miles anyway
Disengagement you can adjust, engaging you can't
You've got it now

 

Finally got my first ride in, about 2.5 miles just around a few blocks. Man, this thing runs way better than I remember; the bike just wants to go! I still need to do some more syncing work. The cylinder 1's pipe was slow to warm up and there was a little stumble right off idle. After that stumble though, it's a freakin' rocket! I'm stoked that nothing's fallen apart yet.

 

The stumble probably isn't a synch issue, but it might smooth out after.

 

What are you thinking, I messed something up with the carbs?

 

Ride it for a while. I find that after I've had one apart or it has sat for an extended time a 50 mile ride then a re-sync and readjust of the idle mixtures works best. Let's things settle in an you don't go chasing little gremlins.

 

I will hopefully be taking the bike on an 85 mile or so trip on Sunday, so maybe things will smooth out a little. This is provided the weather holds out and I can get the bike to where I am comfortable. The bike holds an idle now, which it didn't before, so I am ahead at least in that aspect! Even if I things aren't running 100%, that's OK, as long as whatever is the issue isn't causing damage, I can live with it until the snow arrives.

 

Well, I did another sync this evening and took the bike out for about 10 miles. The stumble is mostly gone now, so I think I'm going to have to bite the bullet and get a color tune to really dial it in. The first cylinder is still slow to warm up, and doesn't get as hot as the others. I got some new vacuum line because the old one split a little, and there wasn't enough vacuum to pull gas through. I'm sure that helped a little as well. Besides that stuff I'll need to work on a few electrical items because my left blinker isn't working unless I touch it and I think my clutch safety switch bit it because I can only start in neutral. I didn't touch any of that stuff so I don't know if is just a coincidence or what. Anyway, I think we did it! Thanks everybody for all your help, and if you find yourself in my neck of the woods, hit me up and beers are on me. I really appreciate all the help; I couldn't have done it without you guys. I'm sure I'll be around to clean up the rest of the other stuff, but it looks like the starter clutch replacement was a success! How refreshing it is to be able to start the bike under its own power!

 

No, but there may still be a bit of crud stuck in the idle passage of #1. The passages are a royal PITA to get fully clean sometimes.

 

I'll have to see if I can poke around there without taking the carbs off, at least its on 1, so it isn't too hard to access! I also still need to throw on new spark plugs, I was waiting to do that until I start doing plug chops/colortune or at least idle drop method. I might cut off a little bit of plug 1's wire to see if that helps, the wire fell out of the boot when I bumped into it the other day. Maybe it isn't connecting well. I might have to get some new coils with non-integral wires, my plug 1 wire is starting to get a little short because I have had to replace that spark plug boot 3 times from someone running into my bike and I cut off a little bit each time. I need to invest in parallel parking lessons for my neighbors...

 

Pull the mixture screw and blast some carb cleaner through, then drain that float bowl.

The plug boot sounds like the culprit though.

 

Well, I sprayed down into the mixture screw opening and no change. I cut off a little more of the plug wire and no dice there either. Going to change the plug once I can find the spark plug socket. If that doesn't work I'll pull of the bowl and remove the pilot jet and see if that helps. I imagine riding on 3 cylinders isn't great for the engine, is that the case? I was planning on going on a 200 mile round trip today/tomorrow, so I'm thinking maybe I should just take the car if I can't get that first cylinder to get in line.

 

Looks like it was the spark plug, put a new one in and it started getting hot right away

 

Ok, sooooo, this is a bit embarrassing, but I'm going to post it anyway. While the pipe numero uno did start getting warm after the above step, it never did get as hot as the others. I also noticed a significant decrease in my gas mileage (getting around 100 miles per tank). Well, I just made a carb rack this weekend to help out with another member's carbs and once I was done with those I figured, "what the heck,I have all this crap out so I might as well bite the bullet and check things out and install the metal tipped needles I just got from Chacal as a possible solution to the above mentioned issue" I worked my way down from carb 4 to 1 and when I got to the last one I had a bit of a surprise. Sitting there on my float was a beautiful, shiny pilot jet. I feel fairly certain that this will completely resolve the issue, though I couldn't put everything back together before it started raining. This could probably go in the stupid thing I did thread, but I figured the folks at home deserve some resolution here. I'll just be here in the corner with the cone hat on.

 

Actually, that sounds like a really smart decision!

 

Did you also find a palm-shaped mark on your face?

 

You know it. I would have been more frustrated if I wasn't so happy to have finally found out what the issue was and that it was an easy fix.