Headlight issues...sometimes it works and sometimes not.

I've reread the thread and there appears to be more than 1 fault in the system.

Is there no low beam and only high beam regardless of the headlight switch position (@Tony222 is this correct?)...or is there no light at all when lo is selected on the switch? These are important questions and I may have misunderstood what is actually happening. Need an answer here Tony.

The headlight high beam goes on as soon as the key is on. This happens with both relays plugged in. I suspect the wiring has been modified to work this way.

When the headlight relay wiring was jumped (blue/black to red/yellow) the instrument cluster came on (it was not on previously with the headlight relay). This is the correct function of the circuit. According to every diagram that's been posted...the instrument light, high beam, low beam should all function when cranking/started...not before.
The tail light comes on when the key is turned and is independent of the headlight relay circuit. It is also a blue wire, same as the instrument light but not in the same circuit.
The headlight relay was not functioning correctly...it was tested by Tony and was found to be closed. Having no instrument lights prior to it being jumped also confirms this. Although it didn't effect the headlight low beam.

Does the headlight come on without the relay (and not jumped)? Need an answer here Tony.

 

should read "not closed"

 

Ok , I am out in the garage checking stuff out. When the relay is pulled and it is not jumped there are no lights what so ever. When the relay is in and bike not running but key forward I have instruments and hi but no low. When it is jumped I have the same, instruments and high beam but no low beam. Starting to dig into the wires. thanks

 

Ok so power is coming from the relay harness (blue/black wire) not from another circuit... No lights what so ever?...should have tail light.

I'll ask again...when jumped and the switch selector is on low, is there light at the headlight (high beam)?

 

Yes I have a tail light. I am just looking at the low beam, high beam and the instruments always. NO, when jumped and on low there is no headlight what so ever.

 

Okay got something, checking the connections moving up the wires:

There is a 3 wire connector with a green wire, a yellow wire and a yellow wire with a red stripe. When the key is on and the relay IS jumped, If I squeeze the wires in that connector with the 3 wires I get a light with the switch on low. It appears to be the low beam and the high beam and instruments come on also.

 

Okay, tried to clean the 3 wire connector but after several tries it is still faulty when I jiggle or squeeze the wires so I cut out the connector out and wired the 3 wires together direct. Now when the motor is off and the key is forward I have low beam, high beam and instruments. That three coloured wire goes directly to the high/low beam switch and me thinks that could have been the problem. I will put everything back together and the tank on and try firing it up to see what I got . I will put the relay back on and try it.

 

So I took the bike outside and fired it up with the original yellow dotted head light relay in and I had nothing. No low beam, no high beam and no instruments. I then put in the blue dot relay that is for the kick stand sensor and then I had everything. I have the instruments , low beam as well as high beam. That happens whether the bike is running or not. I would assume that I fixed the short but the original headlight relay is shot. I will stick with the blue dot relay in there for now until I can buy a proper headlight relay and then it should all work as in nothing when the bike is not running and then everything when the bike is running.

 

I will leave the wires bare for now and the tank off for a couple hours in case you guys want me to check something else. I just made an appointment with a shop to get my carbs checked out even thought the guy that I bought it from says he had had them all apart and cleaned them out and redid them. That's the worse but I am finding out that the guy that I bought it from is not a very good mechanic at all

 

Firstly, you didn't have a short!
Neither relay is working correctly, as far as I can make out. The relay should energise when the engine runs, the yellow spot one just latches on until you key the starter.

 

Jackpot, well done!

 

Thanks. Find me a head light relay please and now I am on to fixing the horn which doesn't work either and also the odometer rest knob is broken off and that's what I usually reset to be able to tell how much gas I have left. This bike has no gas gauge or alt charging gauge either and that sucks. Okay back to fixing.

 

Sounds like a few electrical gremlins...
Before getting another headlight relay (perhaps yours can be fixed) lets confirm the actuation working correctly. With your multimeter, probe the white wire with the engine off and key on. Power comes from AC Generator thru a diode (in the headlight bucket). That diode controls a lot of functions...
How many volts?

 

I put the positive end on the white wire of the relay and grounded my black to the battery and I got a reading of 5 volts. How does that sound?

 

p.s. I hate Gremlins. I found wires like for the horn that were just cut and twisted together loosely and then some electrical tape put on them....ugh.

 

The one I just tested was the one that I have in there for the seat sensor with the blue dot. Did you want me to switch them to the yellow dot one and try it again?

 

I was thinking you shouldn't see any...

Not equipped or not working?

 

Not equipped. When I was checking out the pics of the bike I must have been looking at a Seca and not a Maxim. The Maxim has a speedometer and a tack. Thats it.

 

Oh yeah and speedometer cable doesn't work so I had to order a new one. Question is...what does work on this bike...lol

 

No, test the white wire in the headlight relay without any relay in the slot...shouldn't make any difference if you have a relay in there or not. This wire (white one) "initially turns on the relay"...so without any power coming to the relay (through the white wire) it doesn't actuate the headlight circuit. This is why the headlight on the bike (normally) doesn't come on until it's started. Clear as mud?

 

OOhhhh yes clear as mud...lol. Tested without the relay in and still 4 or 5 volts.

 

So now I started playing around with the old headlight relay with the yellow dot. Before when I touched it to 12 volt nothing would happen. Now when I jump it with 12 volts it clicks shut. I put it in the bike and there's nothing when the key is just on and nothing even after I start the bike. I will test the white wire again when the bike is just sitting and key on for power and also when the bike is running for voltage.

 

Now I tested the white wire and it was sitting at 5 volts again. I tested the white wire after starting the bike and the white wire tested like 13 volts. I plugged in the headlight relay that was working perfectly on a test battery at 12 volts and nothing. No lights of any kind. Me thinks I found another Gremlin.

 

I couldn't find any specs for the relay (other than coil winding resistance being 100 ohms)...I don't know for sure how many volts/milli-amps triggers it. Could be 6...dunno. If someone with a 550 could check theirs...as a comparison.

 

White wire at 13 volts running sounds right...5 volts not running should be confirmed.

Sounds like you're making gremlins...

 

THe only thing I can think of is that the white plastic wire connector is not making proper contact with the relay just like the 3 prong plastic wire connector that I fixed for the headlight switch by wiring it direct. I can cut the 4 wires off of the plastic connector and hook them directly to the relay to see but once I cut those wires there is no turning back.

 

No, no, no, no...no!
Wait for confirmation of the 5 volts (not running).
That headlight relay either has to be refurbished (there might be thread on here about it) or tossed....I wouldn't rely on it.

 

Ok I tried that. I bypassed the white plastic connector and went direct to the relay and I still have nothing. I am stumped. Why would the relay work when tested on a 12 volt battery and then I test the white wire which has 12 volt and then you connect them and have nothing? Making Gremlins...lol. Okay I am stopping for now. There's a point where you have to just cut your losses. I will put the other relay in and get things working again all the time better than no time.

 

oops... didn't see your "no no no" in time and its a done deal. No big deal

 

The white wire should be virtually zero with the bike not running, and near 12 volts running.

The Headlight relay has a pull in voltage of approximately 6 volts, and will latch once pulled in if functional. If the charging system is not working or the diode block is missing / defective you will not have a headlight with a stock setup once the bike starts.

With a functional system you can disconnect the 3 pin AC Generator wire and with the key on apply 12V directly to the main harness side of the generator connector and the headlight should come on and stay on until the key is set to off - this occurs on only one of the three wires. This is also handy for those with the Atari to activate the Atari for troubleshooting issues.

With a side stand relay installed into the headlight relay position the headlight should illuminate with the key on and go out when the bike is started once the generator spins up and engages the relay opening the normally closed contacts.

Headlight relay normally open contact, side stand relay normally closed contact.

 

Thanks for the info and schematic Rooster

 

Hmm, don't know about gremlins...
Anyway, looks like neither relay is pulling in, and if the white wire is going to 12v with engine running then the relay(s) are not getting an earth (black lead). I think @kmoe did suggest cleaning of spade connectors - looks like he may have had a point?

 

Yeah mini there is something still going on there. I still am a bit away from even going on a good test drive with that bike so I am taking a break from it. Here in Saskatoon its going to be 14 celcius above so I put insurance on my Goldwing and just fired that up. Going for my real first ride on a bike in 2021!!!

 

Morning all, I tested the headlight relay according to a guide that Tom sent me and it appears that the relay is good. I am guessing that a wire that goes either into or out of the relay is the problem or a faulty connection somewhere. Any ideas?

 

check the control the high low switch wire may be loose or contact corroded.
what you are looking for is where the voltage is or is not.
constant going in then look at what comes out of switch then work forward or rearward depending on what you get

 

Sounds good and thanks. Have I told you how much I hate electrical problems? ugh!

 

So you fixed the first issue with relay bypassed by cutting out the connector.

You then verified with the side stand relay installed that you had high and low beam as well as indicator lights

So the only issue now would be the headlight relay either being bad or it is not getting the 12V to the white wire when the bike starts to latch the relay. The 12V would be missing because of an AC Generator that is not working, a defective diode block, or defective wiring. Remember if you have it totally assembled you can turn the key on with the AC Generator connector disconnected and take a jumper attached to 12V and touch each one of the three AC Generator terminals on the main harness side. If the diode block and relay are working one of those 3 wires when touched with 12V the headlight will come on and latch on. If you get nothing then there is an issue with wiring, diode block, or headlight relay. If the headlight comes on and stays on then your charging system AC Generator is not working.

 

Yes, look up to post #82.
You're not listening are you?

 

My new tire is coming in today so I took the front tire off. The bike has no center stand of course so I have it on a jack with the side stand and now the front tire is off of it so I am not doing anything to it for now as it may become a weee bit tipsy. All work on the XJ is suspended until I get the new tire on the rim and the tire back on the bike. Working on my Goldwing for ow and the weather here just went cold again so no more bike riding until further notice

 

Okay tire is back on and I have been driving the XJ just around my neighborhood. I am now having clutch problems but its suppose to snow so I am getting back to the headlight relay issue and trying to get that going. I will start trying to clean the spade connectors and take it from there. p.s. Whats a spade connector...lol. I will google it thanks

 

I put on all new spade connectors that were going to the relay. They are good to go.