Proper shifting procedure

Ok, this might seem like a dumb question but what is the proper way to run through the gears on an '82 750 Seca?

I've heard via hearsay that you don't need to use the clutch to go from 1st to 2nd, then use the clutch to run through the rest of the gears, and that you don't necessarily need it when you run back down.

I'm a new rider and got flustered one day, and actually made the 1st-2nd shift without the clutch and without grinding or jumping a couple of times. I then consciously stepped down through a few gears without the clutch.

I realize that just because I can do this, doesn't mean that I should do this. Is this normal to be able to do this? Should I not be doing this? Oh, I verified that I don't have any clutch slippage. I'm pretty sure my clutch is properly adjusted.

Thanks.

 

I have done it once or twice by accident.
Not recommended for common practice.

When I used to drive stick shift cars it was common to be able to shift without clutch when the RPMs allowed synchronizing of gears. It only happens at one particular RPM for each combination of pairs of adjacent gears.

Bet you a dollar that its a really bad idea to do on a regular basis.

 

There was a rather heated thread about this last summer.
Imagine a minute fleck of metal coming off the "dog" or the gear everytime you don't get it perfect. Add that up, it becomes wear.
Unneeded wear and metal in your oil.

If your clutch cable breaks, you can ride the bike home, that's about all I'd do.
Now let's hear from the "experts". :twisted:

 

Fair enough. I won't do it as normal operating procedure. I had just "heard" that it was "normal" to do in certain instances. It sounded suspect to me and I just wanted to confirm.

Hey TIMEtoRIDE: I PM'd you but maybe you didn't get it. I mailed the MO to you for the spring and turnsignal.

 

Yes there was. The bottom line is that you do stand a chance of causing gearbox damage unless you're so good at it you get it right every time.
Coupled with the fact that the only way to access the transmission on an XJ is to pull the motor and split the cases, the general consensus is that using the clutch is a good way to prevent unnecessary downtime.

 

I followed the clutch/no-clutch controversy las summer on this site. I couldn't stop shaking my head in amazement that the issue was being thrown around.

Why why why would you not use the clutch? There is no reason to not use it and a case full of little expensive bits begging for you to use it.

If for some reason you don't like to use a clutch you might consider buying one of the 750cc Hondamatics. It escapes me entirely why one would run the risk of doing EXPENSIVE damage to your ride because you heard that shifting without a clutch can be done.

That lever on the left handlebar is there for a reason. I use it every shift every time. No matter what I hear through the grapevine.

We could all do things "because we can" but we choose not to because of the risk involved. It would seem that this might be one of those times.

Well, nuff said.

 

amen.

 

There is always a benefit to risk ratio to every equation

Some may consider the gearbox an easy maintnence issue, others may cry for days

I like using the clutch as my bike trys to stay a daily rider.

Risk/Benefit Ratio

Risk=Gearbox/engine damage
Benefit=Quick shifting/ possibly shaving a tenth of a second

 

it can be done, you should know how to do it, just in case you have to but to do it on a regular basis, don't
i do it sometimes on 4 to 5 just because i'am feeling lazy, 1 to2 seems to violent on a XJ, down shifts, never
you might have been talking to a MX guy, they rarely use the clutch
try putting some pressure on the shifter before you pull in the lever
it seems to work better for me, thats the only way my BMW shifts right

 

Sushi- - got the PM, but not the MO. The goods are ready to go PDQ.

And for everybody's entertainment, the gear-jammer thread:

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic ... shift.html

Semi trucks can be shifted this way because the relative speeds are so much slower, and the drivers don't own the transmissions.

 

Ass. Fault,

Don't forget the risk to not doing it is atrophy of left forearm...

 

Well Gentlemen, apparenty not 'nuff said. After my self serving, biased diatribe, (which I still believe is correct) I found this on the Yamaha web site. http://www.yamaha-motor.com/sport/yccs.aspx. Apparently some people do feel the need to shift without using the clutch (or even their feet) and Yamahammer has developed just the ticket to make sure this happens safely and without causing internal damage to the bike. I would, however, suggest the purchasing the extended warranty.

You MUST read the 2 pages it takes to describe this miracle marvel. It requires internal components, electronics, indicator lights, etc. to make it work.

WHY NOT JUST PULL THE FREAKIN' HANDLE?????????

 

I'm going to use the clutch. I only asked the question to clear up some hearsay that I'd heard and read about a while back.

If I were desperate for an automatic gearbox I'd buy a new Ridley.

 

I understand. This practice is more common than you think and I have never understood why. It just seems so fraught with danger at what reward? I can assure you that the way I ride 10 seconds per shift wouldn't make a difference to me let alone 1/10 of a second. Now my son in law???? I'm pretty sure he would be a no clutch shifter. Oh well the trifles of youth............

You have a great time with your bike and be safe!

Wamaxim

 

dynatek makes a much simpler device for full throttle clutchless shifting. no internal parts. it has a pressure sensor on the shifter, and when you apply pressure to shift, it cuts the spark momentarily allowing the gear shift to happen smoothly. you never have to lift off the throttle.

if you dont have it, you need to manipulate the throttle in a manner to relieve tension on the dogs, allowing them to slip into the next gear. when done properly, the shifter only requires slight pressure (not looking to slam it into the next gear) and it will be an almost seamless shift with no jarring or slamming.

when a clutchless shift is done properly, the "wear and tear" on the internals is no worse than if you were to go from accelerating to engine braking.

now with that said, this thread is about to turn into a multi page debate. i use the clutch usually, but if i have a straight open stretch ill rip through the gears clutchless, even decel back down to first clutchless. my race machine gets ABUSED, if i use the clutch its barely disengaged. its had the same dogs since 03. this winter i will be changing them out, but only because i have new cryo-treated ones to put in while i am stroking it. they really arent showing signs of wear.

 

It's faster to shift without it. That's why.
Any drag racer worth his weight in salt knows using the clutch is SLOOOOWW. Why do you think air shifters were invented.
If you use the clutch for anything but controlling the launch, you're losing valuable time and are actually punishing the clutch discs as you disengage and engage them at full throttle.
Those of you who only putt around on your bikes and who think anyone who needs a speedo that goes above 85 mph is insane, will probably never understand those of us who are WFO and shifting clutchless, on our way to bending that speedo needle around the stop peg.
That's ok. there's room enough for both of us here.

Unless you're just putting or cruising around, the only use for the clutch is when you're downshifting and coming to a stop.

What i do?:
Putting = clutch up and down the gears.
On the gas = clutchless up, but clutch down (acts like a slipper and i can modulate rear tire lock up when hard on the brakes)

And yes, i agree about the risk/reward wear and tear analysis, but if you're WFO and having a blast, you've got to be willing to pay the band for the dance.

PS. i've been shifting up without the clutch on ALL manner of bikes since around 1978. Both dirt and street. Cruiser and sport bike. Never had a lick of trouble on ANY one of them. In fact, when hard on the gas, i'm actually smoother WITHOUT the clutch. Just a fraction of a crack off the throttle (almost imperceptable) and a quick snick up.

Enjoy!
8)

 

My 550 really likes clutchless upshifts from 2nd to 3rd and up. I pull the shifter up just a bit, and it just slips into next gear when it's ready. Most of the time I do use the clutch though, out of habit...

 

I LOVE THIS FORUM. Plenty of room to disagree. I am the first to admit I ride a bike like I drive a car. Like an old woman! When I insured my Maxim the ins. lady ran my driving record. She looked up from the computer withis shocked look on her face and exclaimed "you don't have any points on your record"! At which time I explained to her that the only ticket I've had in 20 years was for not wearing a seat belt. I hate serat belts but not so much that I'm willing to pay $101 every time I get caught. I could take a long time between shifts and I'd never know the difference at the end of the day. A 500 mile ride might take me 30 seconds longer because I use the clutch.

 

I can totally respect all of that. I'm 44 and getting more and more like you every day. 8)
Unlike you, however, i used to have a framed letter from the commissioner of the DMV of NY, expressing his concern over my ability to continue to enjoy driving priveleges in our fine state. LOL.
I used to use my ZRX1100 more like a unicycle than a motorcycle. I've seen the other side of 150mph more times than i can count and have outrun the cops 5 times in my life on a bike.
I was the rider your Mom warned you about. I used to say "I'm the reason you drive defensively."
As i grow older, i grow less and less proud of my youthful exuberance and hooliganism, but i sure did come to appreciate the performance advantage of clutchless upshifting and that was the crux of this question...
:wink:

if you're on two wheels, you're my brother, no matter what you're riding, or how fast or slow you're riding it.

Peace,
Christopher.

And just this past Sunday, i showed my 12 year old Son how to do a line-locked burn-out on the Maxim. Guess i ain't dead yet. Or any smarter, either.

 

Holy crap Christopher! I nearly peed myself! Touche!

 

I didn't think the previous thread was that "heated", but I may be wrong.

I'm still clutchless shifting and loving it. Came in real handy as me and the mystery white corvette were hauling the mail down the back roads yesterday. He thought he could get away, but the corners were my domain. Up and down through the gears, hard on the throttle then the brake. Leaning the bike over enough to grind the pegs. Hell ya!

Good times, good times! 8)