82 XJ 650 Spoked rim Swap?

Been looking for answers, both here and webwide, with no such luck. Anybody know if there are any spoked rims out there that will bolt up directly to an 82 XJ 650 Maxim like mine? I've seen some one mention Virago rims, but couldn't verify this AND didn't know what year(s) they were talking about. I'm morphing mine into a cafe bike, and prefer the look of classic spoke rims.

 

i got one on order, i'll let you know if it works. It's from a virago 535, dont think it matters what year, as long as it's spoked. The rim is only a 15", but i'm thinking of lacing up a bigger rim to the hub, which should be fairly easy. I figured finding a hub that works with the drum brake and shaft drive is the hardest part, so if this works, the rest is easy.

 

Good point. the hub WOULD be key, I guess. After that, anything else should be easy, right? Thanks!

What year is your donor hub from? forgot that the Viragos span quite a few years, and chances are, only certain year would work.

 

I was lookin in to spoked rears and decided that the 15 was not a option.

but the hub is all i would need as i want to fit a 17" wheels front and rear i would just fit a new hoop and spokes.

why did i not think of that!!

ebay here i come!!

 

Keep us updated on your findings!

 

the listing said 1995, but i wouldnt think there would be a difference. if it's a 15" spoked rear wheel from a 535, then it is likely the exact same thing i just purchased. i believe that's the only virago that came with spokes.

 

I'm concerned with the old and the new parts mating up, properly. I have no idea if Yamaha changed designs over the lifespan of the Virago line.

 

dont know what to tell ya, that's pretty unlikely. they dont change stuff just because it's tuesday, especially on entry level bikes like that.
The gear box and brakes are proven, they've been using the same stuff on the xj's for years. They also all look the same, so there's no logical reason why they'd change.
you'd have to buy one and try it i guess.

 

There were many Virago's with spoked rims (many years). I've seen rear Virago wheels put on a Maxim front, but to put one on the rear you'll have to use a spacer. I would think that the front axles are the same.

 

what viragos besides the 535?

 

I know they put spokes on virago xv700 and xv1100 but I could not tell you if they are any different from what you have. I am planning on doing a spoke swap myself keep me posted on how it is going. But the hubs look the same to me.

 

will do!

BTW, a quick peek at the schematics show that 1990-2000 535 rear wheels are the same. 87-89 show a different part number for the hub, but all the other parts are the same, which means it'll likely be swapable with the 1990-2000's.

 

so i got my 1995 virago 535 rear wheel today. There's some differences.
First off, the brake is bigger on the 535 wheel, so the drum assembly will be needed.
next would be the axle. The xj has a 17mm, the 535 has a 15mm. One bearing can be had in a 17mm (actually i think it's swapable with the xj bearing), but the other one is not. You would have to buy a bearing with a 20mm id, and make a bushing. Also, the drum brake cover would have to be drilled out to 17mm as well.
The 535 hub is about 11mm wider between bearings. I do not have the brake drum for the 535 wheel yet, so i do not know how that will change this difference. If the drum cover is thinner in that area, it may not matter. If it's thicker, it could be a bigger problem. As long as it isnt too much thicker, i think this could be managable for most.
Last but not least. The bolt pattern for the spline on the hub for the gearbox is the same, however there is a lip on the 535 hub that prevents the splined piece from sitting flat down. This can be machined off, but you kinda need a machine shop to do it. Not a huge deal at all for me, but is likely a deal breaker for most.
One thing i havent checked yet is the centerline of the wheel in relation to the edge of the gear box. If this is different than the xj wheel, it'll likely cause problems for most.

So in short, it is a project if you intend to use the xj gear box and axle. However, it could be less of an issue if you get a gear box and axle from a virago. I will not be buying a viago gear box to test this, so i'll have to leave that up to someone else.
For my purposes, it will work just fine once i get a brake, but my bike is far from a stock xj650. It's completely hardtailed and stretched without using the stock swingarm.

 

Just a thought, but I bet a spoked rear wheel from a second generation Virago (like a 1985 XV700 Virago) would be a direct swap, if you had all of the brake components. Is the 535 wheel a 15" rim?

 

Since I've had my 700, I've been a little upset about the whole rear end of these bikes. Not being able to put a fatter tire on or the small amount of choices for rims.I've been thinking about changing my shafty to chain or belt drive and I think I've come up with a solution.

First remove the shaft and swing arm. Then tear apart the pumkin, take the spline gear that drives the rim and attach it to the shaft drive gear exiting the tranny. Then use the pinion and shaft as a jack shaft assembly to the right side of the bike. Attach a sprocket or pully. Then you can fab a swingarm or use a donor ( maybe a CBR right side drive) that will use a wider tire and upgrade to a disc brake.

So what do you guys think.

 

I think you're on to something, there, OnB, especially if you are stretching the rear end. Can you get someone to draw it up?

 

I'll see what I can do.

 

why have i missed this thread?? thank you vanimal for sharing!! i have been thinking if the bolt pattern would be the same on the 535...
im with danno the 85 750cc virago uses even the same flange as my xj.

now how about lacing the spokes offset on the rim? would get me even fatter tire

 

Ok guys I don't ave cad software so this will have to do.

 

I can't read your description O&B & Im sure you have thought about it:
a. direction of rotation.
b. when the power transfers into the hub it gears down, will turning it round gear it up?

 

When I resized the diagrahms it affected the writing. The direction of rotation is why I decided to output to the right (when looking at bike from back to front) the shaft rotates clockwise, so the shaft going to the right would rotate towards the front. As for the gearing I'm not sure, but those problems can be overcome with the right sprocket combinations.
Try clicking the attachments and zooming in.

 

I've got CAD. If you send me big size images, the parts you want, and some dimensions I can do 3D solids quickly. I like the idea and I've thought a bit about this too.

 

See, this is why I asked the question in the first place. I figured it was not gonna be so simple as a direct swap between any Virago of any year. this thread is turning into a very interesting read. Please keep us updated with your progresses.

 

Iwin : sent an email with attachments,hope it helps.

 

how about using the whole final drive and just attaching at the u-joint?

 

good possiblity that this will work, but i didnt feel like buying one since it took me about 10 minutes to make mine fit. again, my situation is different since there is not much of the stock bike left and i have a machine shop.

 

You could use the whole pumkin, but that would put the filler plug on the bottom and I thought this way would look better. And of coarse it should be covered and sealed to apply lube. Also this method would require stretching the frame. Sorry to have hi-jacked your thread roadrash but I hope this is a help to someone and I intend to do this to my own bike sometime.

 

No, no. Don't apologize. You didn't hi-jack at all. In fact, you are helping, so thank you for that. Any input on this topic is greatly appreciated.

 

I got it. I'll see what I can work up.

 

has anyone tried swapping the xj650+ crank, rods, pistons, cyls, and top end into a xj550 bottom end? that would give ya chain drive, and 6 speeds to boot.

 

I am also interested to hear if this has been done.

 

Absolutely, positively won't work unless you have a really big hammer.

 

just so happens......





btw,

 

SPOKES......COOL!

 

I'd take that shaft housing outta there and leave the shaft exposed. That's just me though.

 

then crap can get in the gear box and contaminate the oil. Also, if the shaft or u-joint breaks, it'll likely give you a prostate exam.
The housing also keeps the hub from spinning around.

 

ok, how did you do it?

 

read the thread!

 

a big hammer?

I did read it, a lot of ideas were thrown around.

 

You have a complete machine shop, I'm sure you could fabricate a plate with a dust shield that would also mount to the frame and hold the final drive in place. Whatever though. Just an idea.

 

There's no easy way to put a seal there. trust me, i thought about it. The driveshaft floats somewhat, plus if crap can get into the oil, that means the oil can come out, which is evident by all the oil that was in the rubber boot and the driveshaft tube. I would want an actual seal, not just a dust shield. Which means i would have to add a collar to the driveshaft because it necks down in the center. No way to add a seal otherwise. Not something i wanted to deal with, and i dont think what i did looks bad, plus it's safer.
Also, if i were to go through that much trouble, i'd just machine a new side cover for the motor with a bearing and extend the shaft so i could throw a sprocket on it and make it chain driven.

 

This is more clean than the chain and sprocket and virtually maint free.
I personally like what you are doing.

 

Wait - there's gotta be a seal, or if you hit the breaks hard from 90, all the lube would be in the tube !

There was another hardtail that did away with the driveshaft tube and no mention of a leak.

But the rear unit would need to be held solidly so it doesn't react to the torque (45 foot pounds X overall gear reduction)

 

If you tip the gearbox, oil runs out. Regardless, it's staying how it is.

 

I'm looking forward to trying it. I like all the benefits, and since the bike is a hardtail and drivability went out the window anyways, i'm not too concerned with the downsides of shaft drive (however it looks like the XJ did a good job of eliminating them from what i've read).
The only semi downside for me is limitations of tire size, but i kinda like the big baloon tire anyways.

And thanks! I'm having fun building it.

 

Not supposed to have oil in the shaft tube or boot, your seal is leaking. Time is right about someone ditching the shaft tube on their bike, I think they were able to put a 140 series tire on. I'm not saying you should ditch the tube just that you should replace the seal.

 

That is awesome, and pretty much what I am trying for on mine. Did you cut the shaft housing off the swingarm?

I am also considering getting a virago shaft and rear wheel, anyone have thoughts on how that might pan out?