more brake issues...

i rebuilt my mc the other day... cleaned everything up well..... bled the HELL out of em and get no lever... i can see the pads slightly grabbing the rotor though... so its "kinda working?" if i remove banjo bolt at mc, and replace it with my finger.... i get stiff lever... same as when its all hooked up and bled if i put vicegrips on ANY part of the rubber hoses.... i get lever... does this mean that i am in need of a new caliper? ive bled and bled and bled...... even from the top banjo bolts... please help.... I WANNA RIDE!!!!!!!! :/...... well i am still riding, but... I WANT BRAKES!!!! lol

 

Try this...

fill up the MC and open the bleeder.

Let the fluid gravity feed through to the bleeder and tighten it. Do it for both sides.

Then tap the hoses violently a bunch of times and then give the the brake lever a little bit of a gentle squeeze, without going all the way in, and see if air bubbles come up.

If they do... keep doing this until they stop.

When it stops, try to bleed the brakes normally.

Hopefully this will get the bulk of your air out before you bleed a bottle or two through the system.

 

I see you have been having lots of problems this is the third thread so how about posting some pics of your brake system something is wrong somewhere you are sucking air back in somehow. Give a step by step of the brake bleeding process you are using.You really shouldnt use vice grips on your brake hose.

 

Ij think there's still air. Ill get pics soon. I know vice grips are bad but it was just a test... one time deal. I left the lever in all night and it helped a LITTLE.... but not much. Drove it to work this am and ziptied the lever again for my 8 hr shift. 3rd fourm yes.. sorry... I'm trying every idea everyones telling me. Only one left is to backfeed from bleeder.. I did notice the last bleeder wasn't allowinng air out the bleeder... so I think that was a partial problem.. it was comming out the threads

 

No need to apologize for the number of threads its just harder to keep straight what youve done and tried so far thats all. Did you rebuild your calipers?

 

E I hyaent... only the mc... but there's no rust and boots are in great shape... I know that. Doesn't mean anything though

 

I would clean out bleeder valve before tearing caliper apart. These brakes operate with a small amount of fluid, so any air can be a problem.

 

Buying a 12 dollar speed bleeder screw today. Tryen that

 

Speed bleeder won't help in your situation, they only work with a "full" system.

You've most likely still got some air trapped somewhere.

 

So my master cylinder order never went through... I'm really hoping this is what it is... opened the speed bleeder and put 2 big bottles of brake fluid through it.... by the end of it.. not a single bubble.... brakes aren't great.. but r there... problem is that when there held... they eventually go to the bars... like its sucking in air... I'm ready. To push it off a cliff

 

If when pressure is held and the lever ends up going to the bars, then you have to be getting some leakage by the piston or plunger of m/c. Only other way that would happen would be an external leak.

 

And there is no other leaks external. Only thing that bothers me is that mc was rebuilt... correctly.. no scores on bore... but its the only thing that makes sense. Fml

 

If you have brakes, ride it a bit (CAREFULLY) and put it through a couple of "heat cycles." Then re-bleed. You'll get bubbles.

Lose the speed-bleeder until the brakes are fixed.

Be sure to double-check the tiny port in the bottom of the master cylinder. There are two "false" drillways in the bottom of the M/C, if you look closely, one has a tiny hole in it. This hole MUST be CLEAN. I use a bristle from my parts-cleaning brush clamped in a hemostat to probe the hole clean.

 

Tried all that.. I've been riding it. Lol. Same thing every time. Got another mc used... off my buddy. Gonna try that next. Even though its rebuilt.. I have a weird feeling that that's what it is

 

THE BOOK on Bleeding Brakes is to run a Hose from the Bleeder to a container of Brake Fluid and KEEP THE HOSE SUBMERGED while you Bleed the Brakes.

A One-Way Valve at the end of that Submerged Hose makes the situation easier.
It lets-out the Bubbles and Pumped-out Fluid and MAKES the System replenish the volume rather than draw-back Fluid in the Bleed Container.

If the MC and Caliper are working right, ...
The MC should PUMP Fluid to,... and OUT, ... the Caliper.

Slowly Pumping the MC SHOULD force Fluid and Air OUT.
(The Bleeder is at the High Spot where AIR would collect.)

Once the System is PUMPING OUT >> Fluid, as clean as that which you are Pumping IN, ... without Bubbles: The System should develop HYDRAULIC PRESSURE when the Bleeder is Closed.

If it does NOT.
The MAIN Seal inn the MC is NOT Fluid Tight and Failing to make PRESSURE.

You can OBSERVE the >> One Way Principle <<
The Fluid exiting the Caliper should be moving to the Collection Jar; only.
NOT backing-up into the System.

If Fluid Backs-up.
The One=way valve is bad.
The Bleed Tools are not Air Tight.
Or, ... The MC is NOT Functioning properly:
Replenishment Port Blocked
Replenishment Ports on Plunger -->> Blocked.
Main Seal not developing pressure and sealing properly.

 

That pretty much sums it up...nice job bigfitz and Rick

 

I appreciate all the help... I just wish you were here to literally help. Lol. Just tried other mc.... used but clean w new rebuild kit in it... same result... I hit bars a few times and squeezed... no bubbles... :/

 

Take the Bango Bolt out of the front of the MC.
Plug the Outlet with a short bolt or a Pipe Plug wrapped with Teflon tape.

Loosen the Plug.
Let the MC Bleed.
Tighten the Plug and see if the MC develops Hydraulic Pressure.

I have a feeling your problem is you have a MC Bore that's bad OR you installed the wrong Kit OR, ...

Both!

 

thats what i was saying before..... when i vice gripped my rubber lines... (DONT YELL AT ME!!! I GOT A BUMCH OF EM!! lol) i get a stiff hard lever.... at any point of the hose.... wether it be up by the mc, or down by the caliper. i thought i had bought a mc from mikesxs tues, but it never showed up. my problem is that i dont want to wait a week for it. i have 3 mc here, and none of em work.... i just find it a little suspicious.. but i know anythings possible. you got one kicken around? Id drive up tomorrow to get it.

 

No. But, if you are a short drive away, ... I could come and visit and help you sort it out.

 

Take a picture of where the master cylinder is in relation to the bars on your bike.
Sometimes having the MC lower than the banjo bolt connection can cause a natural position for trapping air and no matter how much you pump the handle, it won't budge. So loosen, turn, thebars, MC, whatever you need to do to get the the master cylinder even or above the angle of the banjo at the MC and see if that helps. Just sayin'.

 

rick im in exeter.... think its probably like an hour... i wouldnt want to burden anyone... so i took some pictures of the setup. one caliper, one brake hose, and the master cylinder is above the banjo due to the angle of the master cylinder setup.

 

ive given up on trying to be clean, lol... thats why theres brake fluid on the hose by caliper, and up by the mc. i figured i have to repaint the tank, and ill clean it all up if i get these things fixed.

 

FIXED IT YAY!!!!!!!!!! was indeed the master cylinder.... after rick told me maybe i have the wrong mc rebuild kit... i went to the other bike that had a "different style.... tore it apart, cleaned it, and had instant pressure from bleeding at the banjo bolt. now i just need new fork seals... lol. bgrakes work great but too much travel on the forks. i just wanted to say thanks to everyone for all their help and patience!! thanks to your help there is now one more safe xj on the road. im happier than a pig in "mud" lol.

 

The THRILL of victory, way to hang in there.

 

Have I mentioned yet that I HATE motorcycle brakes... lol. Simplicity sucks sometimes

 

Have I mentioned yet that I HATE motorcycle brakes... lol. Simplicity sucks sometimes

 

Is that cover missing a screw because you are working on brakes -or- is it broken-off?

The Bleeder looks rounded-off.
You can get a new Bleeder at AutoZone.

I think you might want to check-in with Chacal and outfit yourself with a New MC.
If you have tried to get 1 good-one out of 3 used ones and are still having trouble, ... seems like you owe them that love you some reliable brakes on the bike.

 

Screw is broken... never been able to get a cap off without breaking 1. Pb.. heat.. screw extractors... but I fixed it