Insurance rant

My rant:

I live in Ontario, 53yrs old, licensed since 16, no tickets, claims, suspensions, nada. House, two cars wife and 2 kids insured with the same company. Im the only m/c driver in the house and I pay $360/yr for my 900, close to $400 for my 77 naked GL1000. Another couple thousand for the house and cars.

So, I've found a 2000 Honda CBR1100XX Blackbird that I'm negotiating with the original owner to purchase. It drives like a newer version of the 900, with more power.

My insurance agent will not ensure it, Waterloo Ins Co says this bike is on their "do not write to" list.

Anyone else ever experience this? The agent says the bike is in the "sport bike" category and too "risky" to insure?

I accept that this is a powerful bike, but it is also 12 yrs old, equipped with bar risers and bags, and there are a lot of new bikes as fast that the insurance company will gladly insure.

Anyone else have difficulties insuring one of these "sinister" bikes?



Dave

 

I dont ride anything that powerful or fast, but yes it is somewhat common to blacklist certain bikes, mods, engine size etc.

SOURCE: I was part of the team that built GEICO's online motorcycle application. Specifically, I dealt with converting their underwriting criteria from the old system to our new system.

 

From what I've heard, a bunch of insurance companies are starting to be very selective on what bikes they'll write and in some cases not writing any sport bikes, period. This is in S/W Ontario, btw (Kitchener).

The only bit of good news is that hopefully my insurance will go down eventually (3rd year riding, currently paying 825 a year through Jevco, M2 license)... wow, 360 a year sounds like a joke to me right now. Wait till our friends down south chime in with their rates! Anyways, I digress... Good luck finding someone to write that beast.

 

$100 a YEAR on my xj650 to the lizard.

 

Do you have full coverage? Because $360 is ridiculous. Im 18 and my 700 is less than $100 for basic coverage. I would defiantly shop around if i were you

 

They are in Canada and it's my understanding that Canadian insurance is crazy expensive.

 

I'm interested to see what insurance on my fj1200 is going to be... technically I think it gets classified as a sports tourer, so I might get a break.

I think on the xj, in Texas, I paid $200ish for a full year of full coverage?

 

I hear what you're saying Super, just got my renewal with Allstate. Been insured with these guys for over 20 years, but still cringe when I see the charge.
I too have two homes a car and my bike insured with them. The bike is my daily 2004 Bandit 1200S, sport tourer, with the set up being "tourer". It's insured for $1,000,000.00, can't get less because they set the amount to same as the car automatically. There is no collision, no fire, no theft, nothing but bodily injury and property damage. Believe me, I have called many insurance companies and this is still the cheapest I can get, and it still costs $740.00 for the year.
I'm 56 in Feb, no tickets, no accidents, no claims and if I want "full coverage" it goes up to almost $1300.00 for the year.
I have been told that because I live in London that the rates are higher than if I lived in a smaller town or city, but I'm not prepared to move to save the difference.
Oh, and I put less than 5000 kilometres a year on the bike as it still only has about 22000 kilometres on it now.
Yeh, the insurance companies in the "Great White North" really have us by the short and curlies, the sad thing is there is absolutely nothing we can do about it.
So we just suck it up, pay, and ride.

 

That's heartbreaking and infuriating. What are they, the mafia?

 

I pay $38 a year for my '83 Max 750....... I just piggy backed it on my classic car insurance for the Chevelle.....

 

No, they are worse, they lobby the government to allow changes like this,
The way it's set up they can take the money from you LEGALLY!!! :cry: :cry:

 

Wow those Canadian rates do seem really high. I pay Progressive $165 a year for my 81 550 and that is almost full coverage. Uninsured, medical, liability, replacement cost (includes all my gear), roadside assistance. Even better they sent me a letter stating that they had lowered my rates this year by 10%, didn't say why but who cares?

My brother is in insurance and he tells me that it's not actually category based (sport bike etc.) but that is still a base factor. What they are actually doing is looking at repair cost, liability costs, accident rates and injuries. If those are statistically significantly higher on a given model then they either jack the rates or refuse to insure at all. It's happening all along the Gulf coast in the low lands (houses can't get insured), out west in fire prone areas, etc. Does seem wrong but they are private companies after all.

I would try shopping around. Use to be that you built up loyalty points over time which lowered your rates (making it harder to switch) but many companies are giving you credit now so you don't lose those discounts.

 

I'm in the same category as my fellow Canadian from London. Both my bikes have only the medical coverage and liability insurance, no theft, fire etc. Believe me, $360 is cheap, my previous agent that I had used for 25+ years would not insure any bike, I had to shop around to find an agent that didn't want $700+ to insure my 900.

Its a dangerous place to live up here in Canada, I guess. Must be because of all the accidents us m/c riders are having while our bikes are parked for 6 months during the winter!

Dave

 

I've got my M2 (had it for a couple years now) i've been insured on motorcycles for 4-5 years now. Jevco has been the insurer for all of that time.

I'm 37 years old, i've had only one write off on my record in the past 7 years (My previous car, which the dumba$$ cop wrote as me being 100% at fault, even when it was 100% environmental and unavoidable)

I paid just under $500 i think for the past year, liability only. My first time insuring I paid close to $800 for the year, the next year it dropped to ~$430, the next year it went up to ~$470.

THIS is what drives me up the wall; insurance goes up, even tho you're more experienced, have no tickets, no accidents, because "everybody's rate went up"

Well that sounds a bit monopolistic doesn't it. and i'm 100% sure not EVERYONES rate went up.

Maxim has it right, they really do have us by the nutz, and all we can do is take it without lube and smile we get the opportunity to give our money away to greedy scumies.

It's like the price of gas up here, they desensitize us to the prices then they get fat and rich off our need for the "product"... think:

"Oh SWEET! i'm only paying 3 times what I should instead of 6 times!!! i'm so lucky!"

 

THAT is the other thing that pisses me off, they changed it a few years ago, so the rate is summer loaded, meaning if you try to only insure for 4 months during summer you pay like 90% of the yearly rate.

 

I'm with American family, 20, no record, and it's 240$ a year. That's just medical and liability, but with all
The medical maxed out at 1,000,000 as well as 10,000 medical.

I'm considering checking out what progressive would be, a buddy is insured through them and i can't recall
Why it is exactly but it's cheaper than what I'm paying and he's getting full coverage.

 

Try State Farm. I believe they go off of displacement only. I pay under $400/year full coverage on the ZX. With the XJ's I went with Progressive and both are $75/year (each) with full coverage.

 

I have them for my 4 wheeled vehicles and my house. Got a quote from them when I bought my truck to add the bike on as well. They wanted $200/year for the same insurance I get form Geico for $100. But everyone is different I'm sure.

 

Here on the Canuckian East Coast I pay $200/year for Liability on the 400


From what I've gathered Ontario prices are higher and even more so in Quebec

 

The older rep at my agent called me today, she was apologetic and advised that the Waterloo Co will insure me on the Blackbird, given my age, record etc....Imagine that. I'm sure it has nothing to do with the fact that I already spend thousands there annually.

I'm waiting for a quote, can't wait to see how unaffordable it will be.

Dave

83 900
77 GL1000 naked

Hope to afford 2000 Super Blackbird

 

I don't understand how that works.....What if you put someone (or yourself) in a wheelchair for life? It is illegal to drive in Ontario without insurance, the minimum fine is $5000, and your vehicle is impounded.

Especially with the huge settlements that result from US litigation, how can you take that chance?

 

If I could chime in, I'm new to the motorcycle scene this summer.

Wanting to learn how to ride, my very experienced rider buddy and I set out to find me a bike to learn on. Long story short, I found a very reasonably priced '85 Maxim X. After some tinkering to get the bike safe, I went to go get my "learner's permit". I wrote a 20 question multiple choice exam for $17, and got a piece of paper that said I could do the driving test whenever I wanted. I did the motorcycle safety course and drove around some cones, but there was no road portion, so I opted to spend the summer riding with some friends to get a little experience and then do the road test.

Here's the catch though - Alberta doesn't have a learner's permit for motorcycles. In fact, your regular driver's licence IS a learner's permit. The caviat is that you MUST ride only with a "riding supervisor" (somebody who follows you in a car with a valid motorcycle licence or rides their bike beside you). A little rediculous because I don't see how somebody can help you when you're doing 100 km/h on the highway, but I digress...

So in order to register a motorcycle (to say, ride with your riding supervisor and practice for the road test), you must have insurance. Remember when I said that you don't have a motorcycle licence? And that your car licence was your learner's? Apparently the insurance companies don't know that. It took me 3 weeks of hard searching to find a company that would insure me if I was still learning. I'll note that you have to have a bike and insurance to do a road test - and even if you borrow a bike, you need to have it insured in YOUR name.

$585 later, I had motorcycle insurance for 3 months so I could do my road test and obtain a full motorcycle licence. $585 - for personal liability and property damage only... FOR 3 MONTHS!

Long winded story, but it feels good to get that off my chest. The system is broken for sure...

 

No liability in FL? Really, I thought that was the law everywhere that you had to carry that at a minimum. My Progressive policy carries $150,000 pay out if I'm liable I think that pays for more than 5 minutes in the hospital. And if I just have a small accident and break a bone (not hard to do on a MC) it's payed for as well, all for about $15 per month which is WAY worth it to me.

If you understand the way insurance works it is not evil or a conspiracy, but it is too expensive and that is because of people who refuse to have insurance then they have an event and they usually don't pay that either, especially in hospital emergency rooms. So the rest of us are left picking up the pieces of the irresponsible.

90% of insurance companies are private and have nothing to do with BIG gov.

 

I still can't imagine how you can drive without some liability insurance. At least if I put myself in the hospital, the stay there is free.

The whole "graduated" process to get a license of any kind in Ontario is confusing. It was much simpler in the "old" days, write a test, an eye test and ride someone's borrowed small bike on a closed circuit and that was it.

And I'm still waiting for my "quote".

 

Tell that to the deer population here in Michigan

 

No I'm not kidding you. My brother has worked as a corporate insurance agent for over 20 years. They are in the business for profit, and they are privately owned. His company is frequently unhappy with what happens in DC. They do not write a single law, that's what congress does. Do they lobby congress? Duh!! Like every other industry with more than 10 employees.

You've been mainlining too much 'fair & balanced' conservative news. Get your information from more than one source, you'll feel better.

 

Ok, the news is my insurance co. FINALLY called me back, only $450 for liabilility insurance. Bad news is the guy sold the bike to someone else who is shipping the bike to Libya where you apparantly don't need insurance either.

I keep telling myself I really didn't need a bike with 164hp that will do almost 300kph, right?

Dave

 

my 1985 BMW K100 is 99 per year thru Geico ( liability only) and i got one quote as low as 75 per year. I got that name from the back of Cycle World i think. ?

 

Suicide bombers, warring factions, bullets, rockets and grenades (oh my). Insurance no, kevlar riding leathers yes.

Well you may not need a bike that has 164hp that will do almost 300kph, but you and many others would probably like one.

 

Might try www.ball insurance.com or 800 444 7014. They came with 75 annually but I had already signed on with geico for 99 per yr.

 

I checked with StateFarm this year just to see what they could do for me.


...


They wanted to charge me over $1500 YES you read that right OVER FIFTEEN HUNDRED DOLLARS to insure me for one year.

I laughed at the girl on the phone, she apologized and said their head office sets the rates, there's nothing they can do to adjust it. I laughed again, said thanks have a good day and hung up.

 

yeah im going to check out progressive after this cycle is up with american family.

and i personally dont mind paying insurance. accidents and liability can get REAL expensive REAL quick. would i pay 250bucks a year to know that i dont one day crash into a 2012 Mercedes and owe 25k to fix it, or put someone in the hospital with 200k in medical bills? in a heartbeat. its called insurance for a reason.

do i think that the canadian rats seem high? yes. but do i think that all insurance is a scam and we all need to drop our policies? hell no.

 

So your fine with someone hitting you w/o insurance, it's their fault, and because they're cheap, poor and irresponsible you get no help from them whatsoever?? Sure you could sue them, which costs more than insurance, and if they're broke you still get nothing.

If you believe the people who will opt not to carry insurance, if they aren't required, are the responsible ones with money in the bank, and who always behave reasonably and legally, well then I have a truly rare penny from the 50's I would like to sell you for the amazingly low price of 1,000,000!

Also, I suppose having the police, roads, firemen, immunizations, water from your tap, and all those other big-gov conspiracies should be stopped immediately.

Wanna know why when you go the ER you pay $40 for something that costs .50?? People who don't carry insurance that's why. Your plan makes good sense.

 

Me? Geico, $99yr. Wonder why the insurance is soooo high in Canada.

Gary

 

BC Canada where I live is by far the worst. Your basic coverage is only from one company, government run (Insurance Corporation of BC), my '94 600cc seca is going to run me a little above 1k/yr and I have a clean driving record.

 

Just out of curiosity, dragsta, do you have or believe in house/apartment, car, health, life insurance. Everybody needs them and should have them for their and everyone elses safety and protection.
I hate paying high premiums for all of the above and don't see any alternative in the near future.
I don't think it's an issue of forcing people to "buy what you like so that you can get it cheaper", is un-American or un-Canadian.
Merc is not advocating if it is already in place is he?
So, getting back to my opening question, if your house/apartment burned down and all your possesions were lost what would you do? Same as if you were seriously sick or injured or you hit someone or they hit you, then what?
Like I said just curious.

 

For the '86 Fj1200, if I value it at $2500, it's $450/year for full coverage and $77/year for liability. I have a lot of good marks on my insurance for a few reasons, but I am still a 22 year old male.

If I value it at $2000, rate is $380/year.

That rate was from progressive, only company I checked with.

 

Geico $99 a year! Washington state is also a NON insurance state But not smart to go without it around here.

 

jamesg89, How old are you and how long riding? In my experience BC is one of the cheapest provinces because it IS 1 company run by the gov't (bought a car when I was working out there this summer). To put it into perspective, I pay $1475/yr, liability only on my '81 Maxim 550 here in Ontario with Jevco. The first year it was $1405 and then it went up the second year (go figure), but I got a good referral to get a deal as good as that. I'm 24 come February and any other companies are quoting me $2500-5000/year! It seems like there really is no rhyme or reason to it out here; the prices go up whenever they want to and, as previously stated, there's nothing you can do about it.

One other thing that gets me is why should you be paying twice as much for insuring 2 bikes for liability only when you can only ride one of them at a time? We have a program set up in the aviation world where for $150 (or less) a year, you can insure yourself as a pilot, so that no matter who owns the plane you are insured while you fly it (provided you're licensed to fly it). Wish we could sort out the insurance companies here to adopt a system like that...

 

XJPilot you are definitely right about insurance portability it really should be as easy as taking my plate from one bike to the other. I know it has been an ongoing battle in Canada to allow that but as it is now it stinks.

Having a government monopoly is never a good thing, without the competition in the market place things tend to be expensive. Another example, alcohol is typically a third of the cost below the border at a Walmart but I am stuck with the 'BC Liquor Store' pricing.

I am 23 years old with 2 years experience plus a certified motorcycle course.

 

So dragsta, do you have any insurance at all? Auto/medical/home?

 

Dragsta - What happens the day that you hit someone and you put then in the hospital or yourself in the hospital with over 200k in medical services, plus the money to fix either your bike or the vehicle?

 

OK, two replies but no answer. Do you or do you not carry insurance of any kind? Simple enough question, but you keep answering with more questions.
C'mon twinkie and kid insurance!!! :roll: :roll:

 

No there shouldn't be twinky eater premiums. A lot of people who can't afford good food are stuck eating KFC family dinners, just because I don't have to eat KFC, doesn't mean I want them to suffer with paying their healthcare bills they can't afford either. The freedom you're talking about is out in the remote jungle, feel free to make a home there and hope nothing happens to you! If you do prefer the benefits a society brings you, be ready to pay to be a part of the group

You can't have 'opt in' vehicle insurance because if you are hit by an uninsured vehicle by someone with nothing to their name, then you are screwed. It's as simple as that.

 

...three replies.

 

No, I'm talking about you without your insurance getting hit by another uninsured person with no money.. lets say it was so bad that you have $30,000 surgery? Hmm better hope you have universal health care!

 

and counting....

x2 - what ya gonna do when someone hits you who doesent have insurance and its left up to you to cover the 30,000$ bill?

i dont care how damn good a rider you are, its someone else who's gonna cut you off or plow into you that's the issue here.

smh.

 

and counting....

x2 - what ya gonna do when someone hits you who doesent have insurance and its left up to you to cover the 30,000$ bill?

i dont care how damn good a rider you are, its someone else who's gonna cut you off or plow into you that's the issue here.

smh.

 

The flip side of this is if YOU hit someone and don't have insurance, who's pocket does that come out of?

 

No not everyone, just people who want the 'privilege' of driving, or riding on a public street. And I never said I like buying insurance, only that it makes sense for everyone to have it. Not because that would make it cheaper (it would) but because then no-one is bankrupted by irresponsible, ignorant, selfish and dangerous people.

It's entirely American, it's called democracy. If the majority agreed with you then insurance requirments would disappear overnight. We all live in society and certain things the majority of us agree on and for those things we have legislators who enact the laws we think are useful. If you don't agree then you can try and change the law-Or as has been suggested you can LEAVE society, that way you can have all the freedom you desire. But you have to DO EVERYTHING in that world, provide your food, water, safety, shelter, etc. To get what you have now requires compromise, sharing, and 'getting along' -that isn't big gov it's just us.

BTW dragsta you haven't answered a single question that you've been asked-so how would you feel if your leg got amputated due to the 'other' guys negligence and he was w/o insurance and broke??? huh? crickets....