my bike can not start

for those of you that think you don't have to check/adjust the valves regularly. all the carb fine tuning/adjustment in the world will be for not if the valves are out of spec.

CN

 

Valves DO need to be checked regularly or the motor will simply self-destruct. It's a required maintenance item.

Anybody giving advice to ignore basic maintenance absolutely doesn't know what he's talking about and should not be taken seriously.

 

HI all,

First, thank you all for your help in giving me the much needed advice. having said that i know very little about engines and also do not own a lot of tools that I see on these pictures and instrucitons that bigfits52 has posted (thanks bigfitz52, and I am not ingoring your advice I very much appreaciate it but I am a little excited by having this bike and I just had to try it). I have come to conclusion that i really need to take this bike to someone who can fix it up for me, or go to a shop and see what they would take to get this done. i was hoping this project would not cost me tons of money, I was really hoping that I could do this on my own. Growing up in Bosnia in the early 90's i watched my neighbor work on his MZ 250, fixing carb, pulling alves, checking clearneces etc. That is where my love of motorcycles comes from, dreaming of one day owning a bike and fixing it. While he was working on his engine i would push the bike up the hill and ride on empty. The bike I have hasnt been working since 2006, last time it was driven daily was in 1996 and i want to make it my DD.
thanks

 

Ok maybe I came off a little rougher than I meant to. I certainly didn't intend to bash anyone.

My point that someone with no mechanical inclination at all is likely to create more problems than they will fix, even with manual. If the jump into a project that is to big for them.

Also, without having the actual bike in front of you, you have no way of knowing exactly what does or doesn't need to be done to it. Sure you can make some informed and intelligent guesses, but sending a complete novice into the heads is NOT good advice, at least not in my opinion.

People have been telling me for so long how things HAVE to be done, and how certain things will NEVER work. All the while my bikes are running perfectly doing things differently.

I also want to make it clear that I do indeed appreciate the advice and information I have found here. There is a wealth of good information, and experience to be tapped into from the membership here. That information just needs to be tempered with consideration for the guy who doesn't know one end of a clutch cable from the other.

XJ's are basically street bikes with sport bike motors in them. Hitachi carbs, YICS, tuned air intakes. These are comparatively complicated systems and far beyond the skill set a complete noob possesses. And to beat them over the head with demands that they tear into projects that clearly scare the shit out of them...not so great of an idea.

let them start with what they are comfortable with, let them start with simple things first. Get used to turning a wrench, get used to taking parts off their motorcycle and putting them back on again successfully. Let them build up some confidence before insisting they need to tear a head apart.

Yeah, that post last night was a little impudent and prolly nastier than it needed to be. It was heavy handed and did more harm than good. Just like some f the advice given here. I understand that it gets frustrating after giving the same advice over and over to every noob that comes through. But the noob that comes in tomorrow should not be made to suffer for the noob that came through yesterday.

Advice is never given. It is offered, it's up to the other person to decide whether to take it or not.

I do apologize for not being mindful of my tone while offering advice.

 

They're not that complicated; and the basic maintenance procedures required are well within the purvey of anybody who's "mechanically inclined" even if he's never touched a bike engine before. YICS has no moving parts, it's literally a series of interconnected holes in the head. Carbs need to be cleaned, have their float levels properly set, and be properly adjusted to the bike. Anybody that can read and follow directions can do it. If that "complete noob" is serious about riding a 30+ year old motorcycle then yes, some learning will be involved.

Valve adjustment is not some huge, complicated one-time "project" it's a required maintenance procedure. Every 5K miles. Again, totally do-able by anybody that can keep from hurting himself with the pointy end of a screwdriver. And something that anybody contemplating long-term ownership of an XJ needs to learn. (Including you, apparently.)

It would be much less helpful to withhold the advice necessary to get one's bike truly running well and reliable. If you want to run yours forever without checking your valve clearances, go for it. However science will eventually overcome opinion and you'll burn a valve or two. But please don't advise others to join you on Burnt Valve Boulevard.

Meanwhile, the rest of us will be riding.

 

Did you miss the word "comparatively"? I agree they aren't all that complicated. However compared to other systems they are. Especially to someone who has never worked on a bike.

Valve adjustment, project, maintenance...call it what ever you want to, to someone who's never worked on a bike at all it's a damned intimidating task.

As for what I need to learn...well you know what they say about assumptions right? Do I know how to do it? Yes, have I needed to do it? No. See I don't go looking for problems. If the bike is running like a sewing machine why f*** with it? When the bike shows signs of something being wrong I'll address it. But while it's running so friggin good I'm NOT going to go borrowing problems.

Not once did I suggest withholding advice. But dismissively telling someone they are never going to get anywhere unless they do it your way is just as bad.

As I said, pressuring someone into attempting a project/procedure/maintenance they aren't skilled enough, aren't confident enough, don't have the proper tools for...is just setting them up to fail and setting the bike up to never run again.

 

NO, it's not. Nobody's pressuring anybody; certain steps are necessary for continued success.

And if your bike has over 20K or so miles on it without a valve adjustment, your next post is going to be "starts fine cold, won't run once warm." Go ahead and burn a valve. Just don't advise others to follow you.

It's not "MY way." It's Yamaha's way. All one needs do is read the book. And then follow it.

That's all I've ever done.

 

Dude, it's my old lady's bike, she barely puts a thousand miles a season on it.
At no point have I advised anyone NOT to do valve adjustments.

All I'm saying is let them start with something that is less likely to cripple the engine if they screw it up for their first attempt at turning a wrench on a bike. To stop presenting it as step one for a noob. Start them off with simpler tasks to get them used to the idea of taking things apart. Let them complete a few easier tasks first to build their confidence, to learn what tools they will need.

It's comparable to throwing someone off a boat in the middle of a deep lake as a way of teaching them how to swim.

 

Adis's bike doesn't run anyhow, so it couldn't go a lot worse than now, right?

And I can't see what he could screw up while doing a compression test, honestly, unless he does it without asking what to do exactly.

 

Can it get worse? Really? It's not running, but the problem is likely easily fixed at this point. Maladjusted valves can lead to more than one serious problem. In the hands of someone who doesn't know what they are doing it turns into the birth of a parts bike.

I'm not saying he doesn't need to give some attention to the valves. I'm saying he should do a few other simpler tasks first.

 

Speaking as someone who learned how to wrench on my 550 Maxim 20 years ago because I was too cheap to take it to a shop (back when a shop would probably still work on an 80's bike) I would advise the noob to take the advice of those who recommend proper maintenance as outlined in the service manual. In the years since, I have learned how to do all manner of maintenance on bikes ranging from Harleys to vintage two strokes to Ducatis (you think XJ valve trains are intimidating?) But that little 550 was my genesis, I started with a carb clean, then adjusting the chain tension and rear brakes, then synced the carbs (no YICS tool) then adjusted the valves, then rebuilt the front caliper. Little at a time, but I was glad I did it right (well, except for lacking the YICS).

 

Reaalllyyy... Well said.

Alrighty then. You're beginning to eat your own words.

POINT ONE: You don't "tear off the head" to get at the valve shims; you remove the valve cover.

TWO: I'm no elitist. I'm a single parent who just barely makes enough money to feed myself, pay child support and feed the kid that lives with me. I live 60 miles from work. GUESS WHY I RIDE MY XJ? Oh, and did I mention that I'm over 60 years old?

Itsherbike, A CHALLENGE: Check the valve clearances on your XJs, and report back. Check, not adjust, just check. Certainly you're more than capable of that simple procedure, it's not all that "intimidating." Then post the results.

You've never done it, and you're just talking "smack" so now back it up.

Come to think of it, mine are due on the '83. I'll post my clearances too.

 

None of the "simpler" tasks will get his bike running if the valves are far out of spec. It does sound like they are close enough to let the bike run, but burning a valve takes nearly no time at all. I agree with taking one step at a time, but step one needs to be valves so that step two doesn't lead to a top end rebuild.

Also, please use proper spelling. For some reason the use of "noob", and "prolly", does not provide evidence for the depth of knowedge that you profess to have. I'm sure that you are knowledgable, but your communication skills are at odds with being seen as knowledgable.

 

A compression test IS a simple task and would give some important information about that non-running engine. What's the point of spending time and money on simpler tasks if the da*ned engine is toasted?

 

If the valves are uber-tight, a compression test can cause undue panic.

If they have at least SOME clearance, at least you can find out if the motor is salvageable. If you want a true picture, they do need to be in spec.

 

I nearly forgot to mention why valves need to be checked on schedule. I've been spending my winter rehabing an '82 Virago for a friend. As delivered it would start and go down the road just fine, but had not been maintained properly. When I went to check the valve lash there was none. There was so little valve lash that I had to back off the adjusters four full turns. It's a miracle that none of the valves were burnt. While the XJ valve lash check takes a bit more time, it's no more complicated. In some respects it is easier to get the valves back into spec on an XJ than it is with the screw-and-locknut adjusters that the XV has.

 

You can do this. There are suitable substitutes for many of the specialized tools that are in the service manual. Both tools and the skills you will be learning are an investment that will cost much less than what a shop will charge you. I started wrenching when I was a preteen, because I was too poor to pay someone to fix my stuff. The only time my vehicles go to a shop are for warranty or recall work, and that's because I took the advice of people who encouraged me to learn how to do my own maintanance and repairs.

 

On carb synchronizing:

No it doesn't, and no it wasn't.

 

Bottom line, for me. My..er my old lady's 700 runs like a brand new bike. And until it doesn't I'm not going to mess with it.

 

That's an awfully ignorant opinion. There's reactive maintenance, preventative maintenance, and what you're prescribing - no maintenance. It's your life on that bike, not mine.