Xj550 seca electrical

Hi guys, let me start off saying I'm new to the forum and to motorcycles. I got a good deal on a trade on an 81 xj550 seca - stocked, except for the handle bars, I believe. I've always wanted a bike but never wanted to pony up the cash for one.

OVERALL the bike is in good condition there's nothing major wrong with it (that I know of as of now) I've had the bike a few days, when I picked it up the PO went over it and showed me things, etc. It started up after a few tries and stayed running. It needs a choke cable, so I have to hold it by hand until it's warmed up.

I noticed while revving it (the night I got it home) that the lights get dimmer/brighter. Didn't know what that could be, figured maybe it was because the bike sat for a long time before the PO traded to me.

But now, a few days after its been home, I can't get it to start and stay running. It tries to start but doesn't seem to have enough juice to fully turn over. I pulled the battery and checked the charge, it needed it, so I charged it up and tried again. It started, ran for 3 seconds at 2k rpms with choke, then died and won't start again. Fuel was on prime ( I've read if the bike has been sitting to start it on prime and then switch to on once it's running, good or bad?)

I haven't taken the bike for a ride at all (not permitted/registered/insured yet). Not sure if that could be why, the battery isn't getting charged and just dying? Where should I go from here? I'm charging the battery again as I type this, I'll be going back out to try and start it again.

I also checked the fuses and they've been hard wired with electrical tape, and the battery connections are also just taped to the wires...so...yikes.





Like I said I'm totally new to motorcycles so bear with me.

 

Also, the side covers are just zip tied to the frame... not really sure on the original connection for these? The plates are kinda beat with chips and breaks along the edges...

 

Can't figure out if I can edit thsee posts so I'll keep posting with new info:

After the battery charged for the second time, I went out and started it up, took a bit of cranking but it finally turned over and stayed running (while I held the choke wide open). Stayed running after it was warmed.

I'm going to try it again tomorrow and see what happens. As far as the wiring situation goes, I guess I'll do the best I can. The only thing I've ever wired up is a sound system in some of my first cars, but sadly they looked just like this, electrical tape holding the connections, HA. I guess that's what youtube and Google is for now.

Any suggestions on fuse box situation?
I don't have a manual for the bike, but did a bit of research, just wondering if anyone can tell me the optimum oil to use, as she's pretty dry at the moment. Yikes. There's a lot more I'm finding out about the bike the more I check into things. I'm hoping the exhaust is stock and just painted black...but it may be an aftermarket in which case the carbs would hopefully have been tuned, I've never seen this model bike in person so not sure exactly what the factory exhaust looks like.

Don't flame me too hard, bike pros, I got this as a beginner bike and project. Hopefully I don't need to sink a ton of money into her

 

Well, if you want to keep those fuse holders you can just buy some butt connectors and connect the wires that way, or if you're willing to do some soldering you can get some heatshrink, solder the connections then cover them with heat shrink for insulation. OR you could buy an inline fuse block and put 1/4" spade connectors on the wires and plug them into an inline fuse box. There are a couple threads about swapping out fuse blocks if you check the DIY how-tos section

JASO MA certified, there is a member here named Kmoe with a super informative link in his signature, with any luck he'll comment here shortly, or if not I can dig it up for you.

EDIT: Found it. http://xjbikes.com/forums/threads/choosing-the-correct-oil-for-a-wet-clutch-motorcycle.43702/

As for whether anything is stock, I know nothing about the seca's except they look so damn cooo.

 

Great, thank you for the info. I will be doing a lot more reading on previous threads as well.

I've never had a carburated vehicle before, what are some tell tale signs that the carbs needs to be tuned/synced? I believe the exhaust to be aftermarket, and I've read that with these bikes changing the air box to pods, and changing the exhaust causes issues and the carbs need to be rejetted and tuned.

If they were not changed, and the exhaust was, would it run like crap? I have no base line as to how the bike should sound or run, so I'm just trying to find out what to look for. As of today, just idling in my yard after I got it started it seemed to be idling fine, and revved fine, once I can actually go for a short ride in the neighborhood I'll be able to tell how it actually rides.

Thanks again for any help.

 

Well, You've got an old bike, and since you're the new owner you don't technically KNOW everything that's been done or not been done. So from a maintenance standpoint it would be a good idea to check your valve clearances which is awesomely easy on these bikes. Then look at your carbs, do they look brand new? If not they probably could use a cleaning/tuning. You'll also want to do some other safety oriented things like upgrading your brake lines, checking your rear brake pad to make sure it isn't starting to come apart and if you haven't already you should check out the information overload hour.

As for telling how they carbs are doing by the way the bike runs i'll let someone more experienced tell you that. I'm still a work in progress when it comes to carbs..

 

I'm no expert on the 550s, but your exhaust LOOKS to be aftermarket. Is it 4 into 1? I don't think Yamaha put those on XJs. As for symptoms that your carbs need a cleaning? Well, there's a lot of them, and many are exactly as you describe your bike. As for the fuse box, again, I'm no expert, but I would not trust the electric taped set up on yours... check this out for ideas:
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/how-to-install-an-aftermarket-fuse-box.6350/
Also read this:
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/in-the-church-of-clean.14692/
and this:
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/the-information-overload-hour.27544/
And just cuz you mentioned driving it to test it, you better check this first:
http://xjbikes.com/forums/threads/safety-alert-drum-rear-brake-bike-owners-please-take-a-look.15874/
that should keep you busy for a minute or two!

 

cool wiring diagram for you
http://frankjohansson.com/stuff/xj550/XJ550ElectricalDiagram.html.
How old is the battery?


information over load a must read
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/the-information-overload-hour.27544/

as your rpm increases and decreases so does your voltage which might account for your light getting bright and dim with rpm change. as well as a failing battery
when your battery gets below 10 volts the bike will not start but starter will still spin strong it has to do with the tci unit
following from info over load hour
voltages
For all XJ-series models, the maximum available charging output VOLTAGE should be as follows (all values are approximate):

* approximately 500-2000 rpms: 1.8 volts gradually increasing to 14.2 volts
* 2000+ rpms: 14.2 volts up to about 14.8 volts, with a maximum of 14.8 volts (all models except XJ700-X and XJ750-X)but for now lets work on your charging system


battery voltages after charge
100% Charged:
Using a syringe Hydrometer: 1.265
Using a Digital Voltmeter: 12.60 volts
Using a Floating-Ball Hydrometer: 4 balls floating

 

this link below is to xj4ever.com he is a supporting vendor the link has a lot of good reading links as well as all the parts you will need len is xj4ever his name in the forums is charcal if you start a conversation with him he will help you with parts.

http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/forums/xj4ever-supporting-vendor.23/


yes that is an aftermarket exhaust

 

The exhaust and side covers are not stock. As XJ550H said, on these bikes, you need to maintain an engine speed over 2k rpm in order to keep the battery charged. You said you haven't ridden it so that would cause a drain on your battery. The lights getting brighter as the rpms go up is caused by the battery charging up. Until you ride the bike and not let it just idle, the battery will continue to need to be recharged. A battery that is getting weaker will also make the bike more difficult to even get started. These bikes need a fully charged battery to start easily as well as clean and properly adjusted carbs and proper valve clearances. I would clean the carbs and check that the valve clearances are in spec. Links for this were posted earlier by another member. You also need to visually check the rear brakes for delamination of the brake shoes. Check the date codes on the tires. If they are over 6 years old, they should be replaced. Visually inspect the tires for damage or cracking. You have a really nice looking bike. Good luck with it. You will love it.

 

Thanks guys this helps alot. I'll have to check the rear brake as mentioned. I don't want it to lock up on me. The PO said the brakes were new, the front brakes look good. And the tires are also new, thankfully I don't need to drop money on those. I'll read up on the valve clearances and cleaning the carbs.

And I also found out the exhaust wasn't factory last night while researching some more. Looks like they came with dual 2 into 1, mine has the 4 into 1. There's no brand or markings on it so I have no way of telling which exhaust it actually is. It's a bit rusty at the headers, doesn't seem too bad, I may remove it and get the surface rust off, repaint and then depending how it looks I may wrap it.

Thanks guys

 

More links!: http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/airhead-valve-adjustment-with-pics.14827/

That's an awesome picture heavy write up on changing the valve shims. Just reading through it gives you a good idea on whats involved and how it's done.

 

Great read, Thanks a lot. Seems like a relatively easy job.

 

Hard wiring would eliminate the fuses. Twisting wires together and tapping them is called a bad connection. Imo eliminate future headaches and confusion...install a box, solder and shrink wrap them or use the waterproof butt connectors to make them solid connections. Make it correctly run, then go over all the scheduled maintenance to make it road worthy. Because the exhaust is aftermarket you'll need to remove the carbs to verify and record what jets are installed. It's a good looking bike. Hope this helps.

Gary H.

 

it looks like a mac look at the end of muffler there may be a name there . you can paint it with gas grill paint its high temp works well no sanding required . the stock exhaust is better discribed as 4 into collector box then out to 2 mufflers.
I see it still has the center stand make sure the po mounted the bracket an left side of bike(as you sit on it) it should be L shaped it keeps the centerstand from hitting the exhaust and also from coming up to far causing the chain to drag across the center stand

 

Ok so I'm attempting to remove and clean my carbs this evening, any tips? Looks like it will be a pain in the ass to remove, how does anyone wiggle that thing out of there, do I need to remove gas tank or air box?

I can't see them being able to come out without pushing the airbox back (if even possible)

I read a thread about removing and cleaning and it said to push the boots back into the airbox itself... gave it a quick try a minute ago and Im nervous about breaking a boot or the plastic rim of the airbox... Doesn't exactly go in easy, maybe I'm not understanding it correctly?

 

Since yours is a 550 and mine is a 650 there is probably a difference in space but what I do to take mine on and off (and i've done a lot of that lately..) is I remove the boots between carb and air box first, take out the two outside ones first then the inside, and for the inside I usually take a flat head screwdriver, slip it between the boot and the box then pop that end of the boot out and push them down and out of my way, then loose up the carb from the motor boots and you should be able to pull it back and wiggle it out of the boots then just pull it sideways from between the motor and box.

I'm sure one of the 550 guys will pop in soon to give you a better example though.

 

Thanks for quick reply, I can't get the boots off at all because there is no where for them to go, I can't pull them back off the carb to intake side because they're so close to the airbox. Reading the thread that says to push them back into the airbox makes sense, but they're not soft enough to just mash into a smaller hole, seeing that they have a lip on them to keep them OUT of that smaller hole lol. Could I heat them up to make them easy to bend?

 

Ahh, Mine were extremely soft and easy to manipulate - I also have sneaking suspicion that mine aren't stock. I've seen where some people boil their boots before the install to make things easier, so if you could heat them up then the same should work with pulling them out.

Also if you haven't already it is a bit easier with the tank and seat removed so you can see better and have a touch more room for manipulating. If you are planning on taking the motor boots off make sure to number them or snap some photos - it took me awhile to find the right sequence when I had to put mine back on. In fact, take as many pictures as you can through the whole process and your life will be easier.

Sorry I couldn't give more help on finesse, but I inherited my "Hulk Smash" parts removal skill from my dad .

 

Alright I got them all off, just having trouble disconnecting the hose. Pulling with everything I got to try and separate these. The connection to the carb itself is bad too, looks alot older than this hose, and seems weak at the connection with the spring clamp. From what I can see, the carbs looks pretty clean, the parts are moving freely, not gummed up. I'm probably wasting my time

 

That's as far as I can seperate, pulling with all my might, without ripping the thinner hose. Argh

 

Cool. So two or 3 screws are totally stripped, so I wasted my time getting these out because now I can't even tear them down completely. They're pretty damn clean on the inside from what I can see, slides move easy, throttle moves, no stickiness to anything.

So I said F for now, the bike seemed to run good anyway. Was really just checking for ease of mind. But all I've done is piss myself off.

Now I'm trying to get them back on and I'm ready to turn green and bust out of my shirt and kick the bike over. I've never been so frustrated working on a vehicle.

I pushed the intake boots into the box, as instructed by a few different threads I've seen. I had to heat them with a hair dryer because they're so stiff. They're all pushed in. Slid the carbs back in easily, they're seated in the engine boots. But for the &*$#ING life of my I can't get the intake boots to pop back out. There is just NO room to work with. Tried blasting them with the hot air as best I could, but I still cannot get them to pop.

I think I'm going to throw a tarp over it and leave it for a while before I give myself a heart attack.

 

Finally got them back on after over an hour of finessing and cursing.

Good thing is I get to take them back off soon, when I feel like getting those stripped screws out...

Hopefully it's easier next time around now that the boots are stretched like a mother of triplets

 

"That's as far as I can seperate, pulling with all my might, without ripping the thinner hose. Argh

you will have to cut the larger hose off that brass connector to remove it

 

When you feel the need to kick the bike, just walk away and wait it out. Old machines can be frustrating to work on, but if you take it in baby-steps you'll get it all fixed without causing more problems. Stripped screw heads are a common problem. Get yourself an impact screwdriver and use that. There are two things working against you; corrosion, and the screwheads not being Phillips. A phillips driver will tear up the screwheads.

 

nevermind

 

Yes that's what I did. Took a break had a cold drink and got back at it later.

I'll for sure be breaking it all apart again sometime soon. Those stripped screws are still bugging me. I hate when I know something isn't right. I'll have to invest in a good impact driver. I just moved into my own place with my wife, don't have much of a tool collection yet.

I need to check the rear brake and see how it looks before riding it out of the neighborhood, but right now it seems to be running OK. I hear a small tick, hard to tell where it's coming from but it seems louder on the left side, opposite the exhaust. It starts up fine once the battery is charged, and doesn't die out on me. But we'll see for sure once I take her for a ride. Still need to get my permit and get her registered. Don't wanna risk getting pulled over by the fuzz and losing it or getting in even more trouble for no license/permit.

I'm itching to go for a ride though. I love the sound of this bike and really want to hear it at high rpm's.

 

Ok so today was the day to take her for a test ride around my neighborhood and I can't get her started.

She started before I took the carb out, I didn't even do a full break down of carbs because some of the screws were stripped so I just left them alone and reinstalled. All hoses are connected, everything is seated perfectly, etc.

I have to charge the battery every time I start it because I've never taken it for a ride yet so it doesn't get charged. So I hooked up the charger and let it charge. Turn the key, only and it's only reading 12. I started it before like this so I figured it'd work. Petcock to prime, choke, ignition. Crank and cranks and I get nothing.

How can It go from starting up fine on a full charged battery, to not starting at all over the course of a few days, with no changes to the bike at all?...

 

are you disconnecting the charger before checking voltage
you have to check your starting voltage. if you go below 10 volts it is not going to start.
you should get a trickle charge. it would keep you at full charge..

so is your battery discharging over night?

 

Yes I disconnect charger and it reads 12. When I hit brakes it drops to 10, then back to 12. I have a trickle charger I just don't leave it connected because I don't have a garage or anything, the bike is just in my yard under an overhang of roof and a tarp. Don't wanna leave my charger out, connected to an extension cord and such. It doesn't drain over night, usually takes 2 days. But it's been sitting since before I took the carbs out.

I don't know what to check now, its gotta be getting fuel, what would be stopping it now out of no where?

 

its the 10 volts that is stopping you. can you pull the battery and trickle charge someplace? its what you are going to need to do.
full charge is 12.6 with a dmm

 

What is the difference if the battery is in the bike or if I disconnect and get the same charge? It's been charged 100% for hours, according to the charger.

With the charge disconnected, it reads 12v on the bike.

Charger has an "engine start" feature as well, it doesn't start with that either.

I'll try disconnecting the battery and booking it back up after leaving it on the charger, even though it says it's full now anyway and see what that does.

The past 2 or 3 times I've started it was by this same process. Hook up charger for a bit to get it full, disconnect and vroom vroom starts right up.

 

I charged it today for about 4-6 hours while I was at work. Left the battery on the trickle charger at 2v, charger did it's job and charged it.

Try to start the bike again, and all I get is crank crank crank.

What could the reason be? As stated before, it started on a charged battery and ran fine before I pulled carbs, I didn't even take carbs apart due to stripped hardware (thanks PO), reinstall carbs and now it won't turn over.

Is it not getting fuel? I don't see how it could not be getting fuel at this point, but it's the only thing I can think of.

Literally just keeps cranking as long as I hold the button with no sign of engine starting.

Someone point me in the right direction here...

 

Crack each carb bowl drain plug then close it. Got fuel?

Gary H.

 

Ok I just went and tried it again, this time no choke.

I gave it throttle while hitting the button and she started coughing. Released ig ition, Hit the throttle once more, hit ignition and she started. She ran while I held throttle, if rpm wasn't 1.5k+ she dies.

After I did that and had her running I could smell gas terribly, I look down to my left and gas is leaking from the bottom of the airbox.....

There was no leaks before I took the carbs out.

Did I flood it while trying to start it so much the last few days? With prime, choke, etc?

It really poured out of there for a few seconds, I scrambled for some soak up material and the bike died. It continued to leak for a bit, then slowed to drips.

I turned the fuel off and started it back up to run it dry, I figured I'd have to remove carbs again seeing how it's leaking fuel, but after it ran, and then ran dry, I thought hey maybe I f*cked it up by having it on prime for a minute and choking while trying to start, then later blasting the throttle...so I turned fuel back on and let her run for a minute and there was no more fuel leaking. Just residual drips, not a constant flow like before.

Did I flood it/overfeed it, or is my petcock bad, leaky carbs?

 

It's not your petcock. If it was, dripping would not have stopped.

Your carbs are most likely not bad, just misadjusted.

Most likely you have floats set too high.

 

But why all of a sudden would the floats be the problem, when I bought the bike 2 weekend ago it ran fine when I could get it started (battery discharging problem due to not riding it). Since I've been using a battery tender it starts and runs.

I took carbs out a few days ago to give them a cleaning, or at least see if they needed it, but the PO had clearly taken them apart before because 3 screws are totally stripped. So I didn't even do anything other than a visual check of what I could, and the moving parts weren't getting stuck or anything. So I put them back in to finally take it for a test ride (It wasn't legal before) and now I had trouble starting, even with good battery, and then all of a sudden a fuel leaking problem?

How does just removing, then reinstalling carbs cause that?

 

what he said, but the floats might be stuck. give it a few raps with a screwdriver handle. your battery is shot, your going to take it around the block and it's going to stall then you're going to push it home. batteries are important.

 

OK I'll pick up a new battery and see what happens. I haven't seen any fuel leaking since the first incident, so not sure what that means.

Also when I have it running and shift into 1st it dies. It idles fine in neutral, and with clutch in, but as soon as I kick it in first it dies.

Should've just kept the kayak I traded for it, probably get more use out of that thing lol

 

Be sure to check you oil level to make sure you did not contaminate it with gas - may need an oil change now also. Floats will sometimes stick when carbs are first filled, but it usually points to a problem with the float needle valves that will likely need attention in the near future.

Sounds like the side stand is down, or the plunger is sticking when you raise the side stand. Check the side stand switch plunger and clean it up with contact cleaner if it is sticking.

 

Thanks you I will check the stand switch. It was up when I put it in gear, I was going to move it to a new spot so I kicked the stand up and tried to go but no luck.

I'm out now but when I get home I'll check it. I moved it in my yard before in gear, but it had been on the center stand, not the side stand. So like you said it could be the cause of it.

 

In that case, a float likely got stuck. It happens. I had that on a bike after I got hit by a car.

This.

 

when you first refill bowls with fuel the inrush of fuel and air escaping will cause the floats not to float up and do the job as suggested tap with screw driver handel when first filling

you have a clutch saftey switch as well wiring diagran tells how to bypass if you put your mouse pointer on it
if you unplug the relay under the seat it will bypass side stand switch

http://frankjohansson.com/stuff/xj550/XJ550ElectricalDiagram.html

 

Air box leaking fuel. Solve that problem first. Fuel in the crankcase is not good.

Gary H.

 

This morning she started up with the touch of the button, took a few seconds to warm up and then she ran great.

Kicked into first gear, release clutch, stall. Then I remembered the side stand switch, checked it out and it was stuck. Pulled it out, worked it back and forth and it moved freely.

Started her back up and kicked into first, release clutch and she moves! Wooohooooo.

Still not completely legal but cops hardly every troll my area of the neighborhood so I may take her round the block this after noon. But man it felt good just going down the driveway and back! Haha

 

Still some things on the checklist before she's road worthy;

-Valve clearance check
-Oil chance
-Bearing check
-Rear brake check
-choke cable install (not needed for road worthiness but still needed)

Anyone have any other suggestions?
Tires are new, front brake is new. All lights are in good cape and function properly, horn works...

 

rebuild front caliper and master cylinder, new brake hoses, head stock bearing

 

Check the rear brake before you drive it too much. Did you see the thread about delamination?
http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threa...r-brake-bike-owners-please-take-a-look.15874/

 

Replace the enrichment cable, throttle cable and clutch cable if $ allows. Thirty year old unlubed cables will fail in the near future. Hope this helps.

Gary H.

 

Would lubing them now have any benefit? I'll have to check pricing, I'm sure the cables can't be too much. My buddy ordered me 1 already I think he said it was only $8 and change. So if the others are in that range I'll definitly replace them soon as I can. I haven't been paid in 6 weeks! So extra cash is tiiiight. That's why I'm mostly just doing evaluation right now to see if I can trust her on the road. Fingers crossed I don't need to throw much cash at her.