Starter Clutch removal

I've gone into the starter clutch repair on my xj650 Maxim. I've gone as far as to remove the engine. What I want to know is what is the minimal disassembly required to split the cases, since all I want to do is get the starter clutch out and replace it with a new one. Thanks in advance for any replies.

 

XJ750 Engine removal and split - Pictures.

You can leave on the cylinders and head, and the cam chain tensioner. Everything else has to be removed.
Change the alternator chain guide when you are in there. It will fail soon enough. Use heat to soften the locking compound on the guide mounting bolts.
Use Locktite 515 or 518 in place of Yamabond to seal the cases.

 

Will do, thanks K-moe. I was hoping I didn't have to improvise "special tools" for the rotor and such, but it seems inevitable.

 

The special tools aren't that special. A bolt, a smaller bit of plain steel for the bolt to push on so the rotor shaft doesn't mushroom, and a wedge of hardwood to hold the rotor in place. On reassembly you can wait until after the engine is in the bike to put the rotor on, and use the rear brake and a friend's foot to keep the engine from turning.

 

Thanks, I'm working on getting the rotor off, tried holding the rotor shaft with a bit of steel, screwed on like it says in the Hayne's manual hasn't worked out yet, Since it keeps moving the whole motor, thus not enough force, I'm going to add the wood wedge next. Wish I knew these things before taking off the motor huh. The other book, the Service manual makes everything sound so easy.

 

I had my wife sit on the engine while I turned so I could get the leverage needed and keep the whole thing from moving.

 

You can also bolt a lever to the transmission output flange to hold everything still while turning the rotor removal bolt.

 

Just curious, why do you say use the locktite product instead of yamabond?

 

i'm going to try to forget i read that

 

Those specific Locktite products cure aerobically.
This gives two advantages:

1). You can take your sweet time putting the case halves back together. You can literally walk away after applying the sealer to one half of the case, die, and a relative can come back to the job months later to find the case sealer has not cured (this is not a recommended method of assembly), so there will be no scraping of hardened sealer neded prior to a re-do .

2). There is zero risk of a gob of hardened sealer falling off inside the case and blocking an oil passage (any squeeze-out will mix with the engine oil and cause no harm at all).

 

Oh, just be glad that I didn't upload the video.

 

I had good luck with the Loctite 515, it was very forgiving with time, which was nice because I put the cases back together by myself, so lining things up took a few tries.

 

Thanks for the info. I've only ever used the fsm recommend products, for whatever manufacture. Never bothered looking for a better one.

 

Just removed and dis-assembled my starter clutch to find a fracture in the hub.
No new bits are going to help that situation.
Good reason to pull it apart.
I hope your starter chain and oil spray nozzle is in good shape... or you may wish you took the top end apart before splitting the cases.

 

A new hub will help


Pulling the top end after splitting the cases isn't a horrible job. I woundn't reccomnd pulling the top end apart unless the alternator chain is making noise (which only happens when the guide fails), because of the fairly large added expense for the gaskets and YICS o-rings. If all that is in the budget though, refreshing all the seals is almost never a bad idea.

 

Haha... good point and yes it did.

 

I'm ready to put the cases back together and I'm stumped on One of the half clips. It seems like I hace an extra One, it was stick to the grove in the lower case when I removed it, but it doesn't seem to catch onto any of the parts. It was placed in the groove of the middle assembly. This is an xj650 Maxim J by the way. I want to place it in the second groove, but I think it will fall out since it's not going to hold anything.

 

I'm ready to put the cases back together and I'm stumped on One of the half clips. It seems like I hace an extra One, it was stick to the grove in the lower case when I removed it, but it doesn't seem to catch onto any of the parts. It was placed in the groove of the middle assembly. This is an xj650 Maxim J by the way. I want to place it in the second groove, but I think it will fall out since it's not going to hold anything. The red stuff is permitted anaerobic sealing, I repair the case to figure the half clip thing out.

 

It fits into a slot on the bearing to locate the bearing in the case. ach bearing that requires that part has a groove in it, and each bore has the mating groove. You do not have an extra.

It looks to me like the middle drive gear is a bit too far to the left. Move it to the right and all the slots will line up. There is one slot that does not get a clip (the left one in the case at the middle bearing on the middle drive gear).

 

Thanks for the info as always K-MOE, but even still I have four half clips, and it seems I only need three according to the diagram. The last half clip was stuck onto the the lower case groove. Could it be that this upper case is from a UK version and the second groove is for an oil seal. Sucks sometimes trying to figure Previous Owner history. According to him the bike was brought in from Germany. Everything but the forks have the correct vin numbers. Good thing it's inscribed in the DMV, otherwise it would look like chop-chop job.

 

Hmmm.... did you install the one for the inner bearing on the output shaft?
There are three on the transmission, and one on the output shaft assembly. See #10 here

 

Here's what I have(American 750), I'm not sure if that is what you are looking at or not.
Like you say, most only have one , but one does have two; the slot closest to the clutch area was where mine was.

 

Yeah, I'm not counting the small half clip that goes on the small final drive bearing. That is what has me stomped, what's worst I've been taking pictures until I cracked the cases which was a real chore. So I guess I have an extra half clip, that hasn't given me problems, but don't want to have problems in the future.

 

It's not an extra. Gnat's post jogged my memory. Mine had two clips in the same position that he describes.

And note the quantity of clips required in the #11 position; two.
http://www.yamahapartsnation.com/oemparts/a/yam/500421ecf8700209bc787453/transmisssion

 

Wow, thanks a million. It's my first bike, I've gone from changing the tires, learning how to bleed and change brakes, to the carburators and finally gathering the courage to split the cases. Couldn't have done it with out the support from all of you thanks.

 

+1. Don't forget to do this...


Gary H.

 

This sucks...looks like my starter clutch is toast...starter spins but engine does not... tried dropping it in gear and turning back wheel no joy.

 

Respond to this question in your bad day thread.
What do you mean by turning the back wheel while in gear?
If you were trying to see if the starter would spin when you do that, it won't; even with a freshly rebuilt starter clutch.

 

That's a photo of My jig For returning the engine back to the bike. Question is now, I started up the bike but my shifting isn't smooth even getting into neutral is troublesome. Even when getting into neutral it is not a true neutral because the back wheel starts spinning. Where did I mess up. I did put a new washer on the shifter, I didn't have one when I split the cases. Also I did shift it into high gear when removing rotor.

 

The back wheel will spin when on the center stand because of the hydrostatic effect of the engine oil on the clutch plates.
Shifting won't be very smooth unless the bike is in motion, and will never be as smooth as a modern transmission.

 

There is something definitely wrong, the back wheel spins like it's in gear when in neutral, there is also a knocking sound coming from the clutch side like it's trying to slip into another gear. When I rejoined the cases I tried as best I could to make sure everything was in place, I could move the middle gear by hand, and when I placed the transmission shifter I made sure the teeth were aligned. I upload some audio as soon as I can. Where should look. I'm guessing take the side covers off and take a look. Hopefully I won't have to resolution the cases. At this point I'm scared of doing damaged to the drive gears.

 

Have you attempted to ride it yet?

 

My XJ650 when on a center stand in idle and neutral will have a slow rear wheel rotation. There is also a slight knock (can't remember if it is in gear or not).

But - do as Jetfixer said - try it out on the road (cautiously at first) as it may be 'normal' quirks that you never noticed before until you became hyper-focused on issues . . . .

 

Were you certian that you got the middle shifting fork in the correct location when you put the lower case half on?

 

Exactly.

Gary H.

 

That's exactly what I hope I did, and fear that could be the issue. I have both the Hayne's and FSM, the cases, were able to close symmetrically without much effort, and I was able to freely spin the middle gear by hand, back and forth. But I still have to rule out, proper clutch installation and the shifter mechanism. I might try to ride it on the street. The worry because it's behaving differently than before when on the center stand, like something is about to break, like a clunking sound coming from the middle of the engine.

 

In that case I would not try to ride it. Pull the oil pan and have a look. You can to that without removing the engine from the frame.

 

If I do that what exactly I'm looking for? Thx for your help and patience by the way guys. I'll post an update as soon as I can, this is my weekend with my son, so I'll get back to it on Monday probably.

 

I wouldn't.

Gary H.

 

You'll be looking for the shifting forks to be in their proper locations, and for the gears to slide into place as you move the shifter. You may need a mirror or to put the bike up on a stand. Some have inverted the bike to do this(drain the fuel tank)

 

I went ahead and removed the cover from the transmission side, where rhe shifter is located, and through a little porthole that's un upper left side I could see the shift fork not attached to anything. So I went ahead and split the cases again. This time making sure I could shift gears.
The process was quicker this time around since I already had an idea of what I was doing.

Now the bike is up and running, no more starter clutch problems. However it seems I will be draining the oil yet again. This time it seems I have an issue with the clutch. Shifting is normal, however there is kind of loose metal slapping sound coming from the clutch housing. I broke two of the clutch spring bolts, and replaced them with regular hardware store type bolts, and either they are not torque properly or something with the plates, or who knows. When I shift into second is when the rattle sound is the worst.

Sorry for the long post, I'll give you a potato for Christmas.

 

+1. The proper clutch bolts, springs and assembly are key to proper clutch operation.

Gary H.

 

That's a photo of the porthole I was referring to.

 

Ya. That's where you'd remove bits of broken chain guide if needed.
I suggested removing the oil pan because it gives you a much better view.