Ethanol

I just read something interesting that I did not know.

The ethanol that is put in gasoline decreases gas mileage. I got my info from a Chevron FAQ, and they said:

It is used to oxygenate the fuel (mostly in the winter). This is the same thing that MTBE does, but ethanol has to be used in some parts of the country. Apparantly, both MTBE and ethanol decrease gas mileage, but ethanol is worse. Some study by Berkley found that ethanol burns with 25% less energy than normal gas. Sounds like it has lower stored energy.

There was another thing on the Chevron site that said that it should be fine with newer engines, but they said it could be bad in older engines. Chevron said that if it is not specified in the owner's manual, then ask the manufacturer.

Does anyone know if our engine has any specs on ethanol? If not - has anyone asked Yamaha about this?

I am going to be careful about filling up at any old station now. Apparantly, gas stations around here haven't been very good about posting signs whenever there is ethanol in the fuel.

 

They will only add ethanol in the winter, to remove water from the gas before it freezes up in your fuel lines. Unless you ride the bike in the coldest months of the winter, I wouldnt worry about it.

 

Better think twice about useing ethanol, it ate the fuel pump diaphragm right out of my outboard motor in one year. Went to the dealer to get a new one and the first thing he asked me was if i was useing gas with ethanol. Here in MI Sunoco puts it in their gas year round. Read the pump before you fill, they are supposed state if they contain ethanol. Can't be good for O- rings, diaphragms & throttle shaft seals. My 2 cents

 

Ethanol is simply alcohol mixed with the gas. Most of the gas-line antifreezes, as well as the carb cleaner and octane boost additives are primarily ethanol. It binds with water in the fuel, then burns in the combustion chamber and released the water into the exhaust. Most of the gas in the US has ethanol added in the winter (when there is a larger issue of water condesing in the fuel) and with the new gas regulations, it will be used year round. I know that the gas companies have had issues with ethanol and their equipment, and it is supposed to be mixed at the final distribution point. They will not send it through bulk transport with the ethanol mixed in.

Due to the age of our bikes, we will probably see some issues with the higher concentration of alcohol in the gas. Especially in poorly tuned bikes.

 

Aaarrgghh, we're headed for the hurt locker! I'm reading in Popular Mechanics that this ethanol is due to hit just about everywhere in the next few months as a year round thing to help reduce the amount of oil we have to import (probably a good thing considering our energy demands continue to grow and the supply continues to dwindle for one reason or another i.e. who did we piss off this time or which war did we stick our nose in). Guess we'd better put our heads together to get ahead of the curve to keep our steeds healthy. I'm not an engineering type but I can beta test anything you care to throw at me. Any comments or thoughts?

 

I know that the ethanol issue is also a concern to General Aviation. Some aircraft engines were built or modified to run on automotive gas (mogas) as opposed to 100 octane low-lead (100LL AvGas). However ethanol wasn't part of the designs. There has been some sucessful lobbying against some state effort to mandate ethanol in ALL gas grades due to ethanol being detrimental to the aircraft engines. I think Idaho is one of the states where this is either being fought now or has been defeated.

The compromise, as I understand it, was to mandate ethanol in the low and mid octane offerings, but not the 'premium' grade. That works out well for the airplane guys, as they need the higher octane anyway, but it might not work out for our bikes for the same reason - but I'll leave the octane stuff for the other thread already started for it.

Just two bits to ponder.

 

The bitch of it is, MTBE is a byproduct of the refining process, so it's essentially free.
Ethanol costs more, and requires heat (oil) to produce.
And it doesn't work as well.
Where does all the excess MTBE that is being produced go now???

Ethanol is a bad deal any way you slice it.

Nachoman

 

Ethanol isn't a bad deal for the corn growers of America

Whose lobby is bigger do you think?

 

He he he, its all about money once again. I haven't seen an honest effort to address the problem that was sincere and unencumbered by some lobby. $4 a gallon is well on the way here, reached that much in Hollywood on Thursday of last week. I have got to get that main seal replaced on my FZR, it's just too darn expensive to keep driving my truck! I've seen these nut jobs and their pimped out Hummers plunk down $90 for a fill up. Makes me laugh, hope you like your investment now buddy (who needs an off-road vehicle in L.A., really?).

 

On the tv last night there was a claim that a garage in Oxford England was charging £1.05p per litre for juice. Fortunately it's a bit cheaper here in Spain.

Faighaigh.

 

Robert - I think we will all be beta testing it pretty soon - at least in the USA. :lol:

I had the opportunity to watch two lobbyists give a lecture. One was for conventional power - nuclear (in this case). And the other was for renewable energy, and other green sources.

I found their perspective very interesting. I noticed that both of them wanted money from Congress (the taxpayers) to supplement their industry. When I asked them why didn't they want their sources of energy to be profitible all by themselves without help from the government, they said: "We can't compete with the other sources right now, so we need the government's help. That is the choice we have to make to help the environment."

So - that is probably pretty similar to the environmentalists and corn growers argument. I promise it will get cheaper in the future, but right now we have to think about the earth. :roll: The reason I am upset about that is that I believe ethanol causes worse emissions! If you get worse gas mileage, then you have to burn more gas and cause more smog.

I will get off my soapbox now.

One last thing - who do you think is going to lobby for old motorcycles? :?:
Certainly not NEW motorcycle manufacturers! They want you to get rid of your old bike. Certainly not motorcycle associations that may or may not be :roll: run by the aforementioned motorcycle manufacturers.

I think we are going to have to take this one up the tailpipe! :evil:

 

I was digging around for more info about my Mikuni carbs when I saw a kit to allow Ethonol to run through them. I'll try to find the link. As far as ethonol being worse its not. While it my have worse milage its a much cleaner fuel. Even though you may burn more of it it still gives out less emissions.

 

Since when has nuclear energy been a conventional source? There is nothing conventional about it. Now the fact that 9 pounds of uranium yields the same amount of energy as over 230 thousand tons (yes tons) of coal makes it really attractive but I'm still very leery of the long-term issues (10,000 year half life is a mighty long time, I'm thinking of posterity here). I'm all for "greener" alternatives and will bear the pain with what dignity I can muster. I would love to see that link Thirdedition, I'll probably make the investment. What about fuel petcock seals? Let's get started finding out our options.