New Guy with some 82 XJ650J Maxim problems

Hi Guys!

Glad I found these forums. My name is Phil and I live in Indiana. I've been away from bikes for about thirty years or so but a few weeks ago my buddy bought himself a new bike and I got his 82 XJ650J Maxim.

He rode it to my house and it worked great. He just put about $600 in it for a new battery, rear tire, rebuilding the carbs, and who knows what else. After he left I pushed it to the end of my driveway and fired it up (started immediately!) and rode it into the garage. Next day I got it out and gave it a good wash job. Went to fire it up to ride it back to the garage and it took forever. Starter solenoid would click when you hit the start button but no starter motor. After trying several times it finally caught and the starter spun like crazy. As soon as I left off the starter switch the engine would fire, then quit. Back to click, click, click. In short, after about a half hour of this I got it to start and left it warm up. Hot, it started beautifully. Cold, nada. I got the distinct feeling that there was no fire to the plugs until you left off the starter switch.

Got it started like that for about the next two days and since then all I get is click, click, click. I checked for current at the starter when the starter switch is depressed, no joy. Then I checked for current from the battery to the solenoid, had current. No current out of the solenoid to the starter though. So I assume it needs a new solenoid. SO, some questions:

1. Anyone know where I could get a solenoid for it?

2. Could the two problems (no current to the starter and not starting until you let go of the starter button) be related?

3. I notice that when you turn the key on the tail light comes on, but not the headlight. The headlight comes on when the engine starts. Is this normal?

4. I need a right side (battery) cover. Where would I find one of these? They seem to be rare as hens teeth.

5. Anyone know where I could get a rear brake light switch?

The bike seems to be in pretty good shape, like I said when hot it started immediately. It needs some TLC, which I intend on supplying but first I need to know that I can get it to start cold. If its going to cost a ton of money I'd be better off scrapping it than starting into a project thats going to turn into a money pit. I don't have a lot of money to spend on this project when you figure I need a new helmet, plates, insurance, and I want to take the ABATE course since I've been off bikes for so long.

Thanks for the help guys, and mods if there is a better place for this post please move it.

Cheers,

Phil

 

Phil, I just sent to you a PM (private message) with some prices and advice........

 

Welcome Phil
First, I don't think your solenoid needs replacement. The batteries on these things are notrious for causing the symptoms you describe. Recharge the battery to a full charge and test again. A new battery may be in order (they have about a 3 year life span, less if it is a cheap one).
You can burnish the contacts on your existing solenoid before you write it off, I'll give you more details if my first suggestion doesn't pan out.
Next, I would suggest you check out the brush length on your alternator. It is a common cause of starting/battery issues as well.
After that, I would suggest that you shoot out the ignition coil leads with WD-40 to remove any moisture left over after the bath you gave it. These lead boots do leak with age.
Your third question is easy. Yes, it is normal.
4th, you guessed it. Side covers are hard to come by. Some folks have even purchased complete bikes just to get them.
5th, Chacal has parts as does BikeBandit.com. I have successfully rebuilt a switch or two, they do tend to need a little cleaning. I would suggest this path unless yours is completely missing. About $20 for a new one.

In closing, I expect you will find a lot of your issues are rather simple to repair if you happen to brouse through these forums. Another (and most important) suggestion is to procure a maintenance manual. Factory or Haynes (I've done well with the Haynes since I bought my XJ years back), you need to have one in order to ease your efforts in bringing this beast back up to scratch. Additionally, you should also consider the purchase of the XJCD that is hawked here at this forum. An excellent compendium to the factory manual if I could say so.
Best of luck to you and congratulations on the score Phil. I look forward to hearing of your progress and seeing some pictures.
Cheers!

 

Hi guys,

Thank you for the welcome and great advice. Following advice given I did short the solenoid wires and it cranks every time. So, I either need a new solenoid or maybe polish the washer on the old one. I assume these are like the old GM car solenoids in that if you take the cap off there is a heavy copper contact that can be polished or turned to make good contact again. If not I'll get another solenoid.

I got a Haynes manual with the bike and checked it to see how the starter comes off so I can check the brushes. Will do that as time permits. Ditto the alternator.

This is going to be a long term project but I do want to get it to start reliably so I can ride it next summer. Then, next winter I can do some more work on it. My buddy builds street rods and told me that if I get the paint he will paint the tank and side covers. I want to do it in Candy Apple Red. He also mentioned a place that will coat the exhaust pipes in high temperature black glossy ceramic, which I think would look neat.

The tach doesn't work but two people have told me that spiders build webs in them so I can fix that. I've been a watch maker for about 33 years and was an auto mechanic before that.

I'll attempt to attach some photos of the bike, don't know how that will work.

I do have one more question. The bike is an XJ650J Maxim, by the frame number and the logo on the side cover anyhow. I do know that it has been rebuilt, probably due to a wreck, and the front end (fork, suspension, etc) has been replaced. On the plastic trim piece that connects the speedo and tach, it says "Midnight Maxim". Is this indicative of anything when it comes to parts replacement?

Thanks all,

Phil

 

All yamaha "midnights" had some real gold plated trim bits, as well as gold painted rims and other gold plastic trim on a black bike, and were limited in number. A total restoration is in order here. Collect the whole set.

 

Now that I saw the pics, I'd say someone slapped the "midnight" trim on your bike--it's not rare...Have fun with it!

 

Phil, as a watch maker, you should be able to fix speedometers right? Buddy! All jests aside, it would be awsome if you found the time to take a look and let us know (I'm in the market for a restoration).
Your bike is a run of the mill XJ 650 Maxim. Your P.O. slapped spare parts on it. Of course the definitive answer is to pull your VIN and run the numbers.
Your tach is mechanically operated. Check the cable, the sender unit on the head (they do die occasionally), and then the tach itself. Each check is easy, you should be able to trouble shoot this in 5 minutes. Pull the cable out of the head and spin it. Watch the tach. If it doesn't jump, spin the opposite direction. If it moves, your upper end is intact. Cleaning and relubricating everything would be wise at this juncture. If all is well upstairs, pull the sender out and inspect for a cracked or stripped gear. If either condition exists, you got trouble in the head. Odds are highly in your favor the cable went south so don't get a heart attack just yet.
Let us know how it pans out.

 

Robert, XJ650J has electronic tach.

Check electrical connections.

 

Hi again!

MiCarl you're right, it is an electronic tach. My buddy says it did work but the guy who worked on it told him that it was reading slow. By the time I got it, it had quit. There is a rather well preserved little spider in the above photo in the center just to the right of the x1000rpm. I assume thats the little critter who built the problem web. I'll pull the panel and see whats in there.

Robert, I've never worked on a speedometer but if you know where to find a junk one that I can play with maybe I can figure it out. They are LOTS bigger than the average watch. >) Plenty of room in there for me to get lost.

More later,

Phil

 

Hey Phil, one thing you can do first is replace your fuse box. That little hunk of junk can get rid of plenty of electrical problems. My rpm gauge did the same thing before I replaced mine. Plus tons of other minor electrical bugs disappeared. I could hit the gas, jolt the bike and it would come on til I hit a bump ha ha ha!

 

Like these!:



q) Wirewerks 6-position Enclosed ATC Fusebox (mini push-in blade style)....the one that everyone recommends using. Includes 6 ATC fuses, 2 x 20A and 4 x 10A.

Size: 4" long x 1-1/8" wide (not including spade terminals) x 1-1/2" tall (including cover). Note that this is a "side-terminal" design...the male circuit spades point outwards away from the sides of the fusebox.

HCP378BC Wirewerks 6-position ATC style Fusebox:
$ 13.00


nnn) Circuit ID Decal for the above wirewerks 6-circuit HCP378BC fusebox. Printed on a clear adhesive backed long-life decal material, this decal specifies (in white print) the circuit "name" (MAIN, HEAD, TURN, IGN.), the fuse amp rating (20A, 10A), and the wire lead color code (RED, R/Y, BRN, R/W) so you can have the same circuit ID info on your replacement fusebox as on your original! Applies to the outside of the HCP378BC clear fusebox cover. The two empty circuit positions are titled "SPARE".

HCP393 Wirewerks 6-position fusebox ID Decal:
$ 4.00


u7) Bottom Gasket for the above wirewerks 6-circuit HCP378BC fusebox. The fusebox has an "open" bottom, which would allow moisture and, eventually, corrosion to get into this otherwise sealed fuseblock. This die cut 1/16" rubber gasket has pre-punched mounting holes.

HCP382 Wirewerks 6-position fusebox Bottom Gasket:
$ 3.50

 

Hi Jackncoke,

Odd that you should mention that. The fuse box is a wreck and I read somewhere on this forum an article on replacing it. Pretty good article with good pictures. Hopefully I can get this done during the winter.

Chacal,

Thanks for the dope on the fuse box, do you stock those? If so, I'll add it to the list of stuff to order after Christmas.

You guys are great, thanks for these forums this project isn't so daunting as it was when I started it.

What fuel do you all use in the 650's? I've heard that Premium is the best but others have told me just use Regular. Lets face it, at the quantities needed for a bike, the cost of Premium isn't really a factor.

More later,

Phil

 

But of course! Pretty much 99% of everything on the list is in stock.

Fuel: You can experiment, but it might be better to stick with regular. Higher octane fuel has a slower burn rate in the cylinder, and a specific burn rate is "engineered" into cylinder head/cam/exhaust design. Most people don't realize this, but using too high of an octane can actually decrease performance----as well as chew up $$.

All that being said, most regular grade fuel is not "cut" with ethanol, and that's a wild card issue and different engines react differently to that factor. That's why you should experiment........

 

HI chacal,

My new best buddy! >) Been making some progress. Last night I fixed the rear brake switch, er.......................it was unplugged. Works great now. Then I tackled the solenoid. I got all the screws out but it acts like the two small wires are holding it up so I can't remove the cap. Do I have to unsolder these two wires or am I just not pulling hard enough? Don't want to break anything. See attached photo, I did uncrimp the steel band that secures the two small wires. Also attached is a photo of the fuse box and wiring as it now exists. After I get my Christmas bonus and get the stuff I need from chacal I'll fix this mess.

Cheers,

Phil

 

Yes, you NEED a new fusebox!

Just looking at that picture gives me the heebie-jeebies......

 

Phil, you will need to desolder the two wires that pass throught the cap of the solenoid. They are joined at the point where the pigtail solders onto the cap. Use a Solder-pullit, they are cheap and will suck the solder out of the joint (they are cheap too).
A new fuse box is in order Phil, yikes!

 

The guy who did the wiring on that Fuse Box was wearing a Gray Sweatshirt with his nickname lettered across the front and a black beenie cap with two big fake ears.

M-I-C ... K-E-Y ... M-O-U-S-E!

Get yourself a new "Wirewerks" 6-Place, weather resistant Fuse Panel and wire-it-up inn there nice and neat.
The trick is to solder on new Pigtails to the Fuse Panel ... Temp mount the Panel and route the wiring ... measure ... then, strip and splice the Pigtails into the Wiring Harness.

It's nice having a new Fuse Panel.
Most of the Ignition related and "No-Start related" complaints disappear after a new Fuse Panel is installed and all wired-in nice.

You don't want to be going very far with the likes of the one you got in there now!

 

Robert, yep! That fuse box scares the bejesus out of me. Thats going to be the first thing I change after I get my Christmas bonus. And thanks for the tip on unsoldering the wires. That will come in handy.

Rick, I'm not even going to try to ride it until I get a lot of these bugs fixed.

I took the solenoid to work this afternoon and with my Optivisor on I could see far enough into the thing to see that the contact wasn't really too bad. I blew high pressure air into the solenoid to get any dust that may have been hiding there. The nuts that are on both sides of the battery wire terminals were badly rusted, as were the wire terminals themselves. So I cleaned the rust off of everything and just for grins (not really, I did it so I wouldn't forget how to do it. (MAJOR CRS) I put the solenoid back together and installed it in the bike. Hit the key and stabbed the starter button and it turned right over! Damned near had a heart attack. Turned slowly as the battery is about dead but it did turn. Several times as a matter of fact, just to make sure the first time wasn't a fluke.

So I'm just going to pull the battery and charge it, then store it in the utility room where its warm until I get enough parts to continue. Can I use my little automotive trickle charger to charge it or do I need a special motorcycle charger? Don't want to blow up a new battery.

Thanks for all the help guys, it means a lot and I'm sure learning about the thing. This place is a gold mine of information and help.

Cheers,

Phil

 

I have routinely used an automatic automotive charger to charge the motorcycle battery. I hit it with 10 Amps and the Charger regulates itself and shuts off when the battery is charged.

 

Thank you Rick, mine does have the automatic feature. I haven't used it in so long I'd forgotten the automatic feature. Will get it set up later today.

Cheers,

Phil

 

A watch maker, you say?

So... You wouldn't happen to have easy and economical access to some mineral crystal lenses, measuring say... 16.7mm?

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=6934.html

 

How thick? I'll look tomorrow but if you just need a round 16.7 in 1mm, 1.5mm or 2.0mm thic, kit should be doable. Let me know.

Cheers,

Phil

 

Hi Phil,

Where you at in Indiana? I'm from Evansville and theres a few other members here. One from Indy, the other from Blooington. Great that you found the site. You'll find lots of expert advice from guys who are really passionate about these old XJ bikes and who really know what they are talking about.

 

Hi Dave!

I'm in Huntington, about 25 miles west of Fort Wayne. Good to know some more Hoosiers here. This place is full of information and good folks. This has turned me from just wanting info on an old bike to being a real fan of XJ's and wanting to go more for a very slow restoration than a quick fix. I've always like the looks of the XJ's, they seem to have a clean look, uncluttered by all those fairings and stuff.

Good to meet ya Dave, hopefully we can get some of the Indiana guys together at some point in time!

Cheers,

Phil