Tried everything need help

Hey guys,
So I had the dreaded clutch rattle I striped it down and the gear had loads of play so I replaced the dowel and ah presto no play

BUT

Its still there no change in sound so I noticed my plates were worn so I just replaced the clutch plates today and springs (what a difference) and I was kinda hoping that would help NO

So with the engine running I remove the oil filler cap and the noise sounds like the basket hitting of something metal but, I checked the basket for play and there's none

So my thought is the plate that's bolted inside the clutch cover is somehow hitting the basket but I must mention when I pull the the clutch in the noise is gone when I release in neutral it rattles like a diesel engine.

Can I remove the bolted plate inside the cover without hurting the clutch?

What is its purpose? cheers guys

Regards

 

check the drive gear and the bearing behind the clutch

 

Dumb question but you offset the primary plates as per spec, right? Just trying to rule out that.

 

I've done a little looking into the clutch rattle, and I've come to the conclusion that it's caused by the clutch basket wobbling around on the output shaft of the engine.

Does your clutch basket have a roller bearing on the input shaft, or the bronze sleeve bearing? My 550 is the bronze sleeve, but I don't know what the other bikes used.

 

Is that basket rattle only when clutch lever pulled in? The basket fingers can get grooves from fibre plates and that slack can make that noise.

 

I will post a video of the noise I hear its strange

I changed clutch yesterday while I was in I tried to move the basket left right up down it had about 1mm of play all sides which I assume is normal

Oil pump drive gear no play

No grooves in basket
Plates installed staggered

Bearing that the shaft sits on looks fine I examined that when I removed the whole basket to fix the drive gear

I have a feeling the play I can feel under load may be dramatically increased but what I don't understand why then if I disengage the clutch it sounds like a bike? *scratches head*

If the outer basket is swinging more and clunking the inner basket won't have anything to do with it? Am I wrong?

 

Thrust washer between inner and outer basket ok? Outer basket riveting on to gear is that ok? Springs in the back are they loose?
Just throwing crap at the wall and see if it sticks

 

All of the above checked and fine I really cannot work this one out seems to be no play in anything all seem tight and secure

Its driving me mad

Uploading that video tomorrow

 

Does your clutch basket have a roller bearing on the input shaft, or the bronze sleeve bearing? My 550 is the bronze sleeve, but I don't know the other bikes used. The reason I ask is that the roller bearings are replicable, while the sleeve bearings were never designed to be replaced.

In my case, I believe I traced the clutch rattle to the entire clutch assembly wobbling around a little on the input shaft to the transmission.



Everything wears a little bit... The bronze sleeve bearings, the splined thrust washer, and all the other parts they contact.



I believe this accumulated wear reaches a point where it starts to make noise. Doesn't necessarily cause a significant performance issue, but it its distracting. Warm oil, sitting in neutral, with the clutch released. Makes an unhappy sounding rattle.

I believe that the reason it makes less noise with the clutch handle pulled in is because the extra axial load on the end of the clutch assembly tends to stabilize the whole rotating assembly. And then while you have the clutch pulled in... If you then put it in gear, the noise stops completely because the whole output side of the clutch stops due to the fact that it's locked to the rear wheel (which isn't moving).

That's my theory anyway.

 

I don't recall seeing any bronze sleeves gonna replace thrust washer

What size are the sleeves will get them just incase?

 

Maybe you don't remember seeing them because they were never really designed to be removed from the basket:



I don't remember the sizes of the bronze sleeves, but it doesn't matter much. They aren't available from Yamaha anyway.

Here's a thread where there was a lot of discussion about such matters. The pictures are dead because photobucket are the sneaky SOB's they are, but the discussion is important as well:
https://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/rattling-noise-on-idle-550-primary-chain-hi-vo.33497/

Summary...
My clutch rattled and I got all worried about it.
I spent a little money and a bunch of time looking into it.
Theorized that the noise was caused by the whole clutch assy wobbling on the trans input shaft.
Tried to come up with an easy way to fix it but didn't.
In the end, I decided that it was annoying, but not something I was going to lose sleep over.

The only other thing that happened on that front is that I bought some thin hardened washers and installed one behind my clutch basket to take up some of the axial play. The rattle volume went down, but not completely away.

 

if the bearings are missing and not available get a use clutch assembly.

 

on suzuki sv1000's the call that "chudder" this guy makes a fix for them https://www.werksparts.com/clutch-baskets-pg-1.html
on a XJ you'd be better off with a used one