Electrical Question / No Start

I've taken apart my '82 XJ550R to clean/paint various bits, etc. I also disassembled the controls to paint the housings. As I'm putting things back together...slowly as I'm waiting on new bars, I decided to test the controls to see if they work. I can't get the starter to kick over. I have power to the instrument panel and it is showing that gear is in neutral. The run switch works as I can hear the coils (I think) clicking when I flip it. I press the start button and nothing.

I hooked up both control modules, the clutch and break levers (no levers in them, but shouldnt matter because the switches' no lever state is the same as the lever pulled state).

What am I missing? Is everything so interconnected that having something like a turn signal or headlight not connected could have an effect?

 

Oh, btw, I also manually shorted the starter button to see if that was the problem, and nothing there either. Cleaned the contacts with emerycloth, etc. Still nothing.

 

Sounds like the starter solenoid is clicking, its just to the left of the positive battery terminal with 2 heavy leads attached. Is the battery flat, have you checked all the earths.

 

Battery should be fine. It is less than one month old and has been hooked to a tender most of the time. The clicking I'm hearing is under the tank (which is removed) about midway along the top tube of the frame. Near the coils. Grounds should be good, but how can I check to be sure?

 

There is no clicking sound or any sound whatsoever when I press the start button. The only click I hear is when I switch the Run/Kill switch to "on".

Thanks.

 

exactly my symptom. No click when I push the start button, clicks when I go from kill sw "off" to "on" I think the senior rocket scientists here got a twofer......

 

It was fine before I tore it apart.

Note to self...stop tearing your toys apart!

 

What caused your bike to get to that sympton? Did you do anything to it, like I did, or did you buy it in that condition?

Thanks.

 

The situation came about slowly. It started taking several stabs at the "start" button before anything would happen. Then, on a run Sunday, it crapped out entirely. I took apart that switch, cleaned it (it was OK) then moved on to the relays. Check my tale of Mystery on my "starter relay" thread close to this one....

 

Oooooooo I love this one. I have played with this about 70000000 times, which is about 69999999 more times than I actually wanted to. This information will all be specific to the 85, but still might be helpful.

Here's my series of checks:

First, make sure that your starter is working correctly. This can be done by taking a big screwdriver or wrench (one that you don't care about, because it's about to get some weld marks on it) and shorting across the big terminals on the starter solenoid.

Then, since that usually is not the problem, I make sure that the starter solenoid is working. On the solenoid, you will notice that there are two small terminals, one of which has a solid copper connection to the positive terminal. If you short the other small one to ground, there should be a mighty click as the solenoid fires. Otherwise, your problem is with the solenoid.

Then I start checking the other relays. I think there are 3 relays that all have to work for you to be able to use the start button. There is a clutch relay, a side stand relay and the main relay. If either of the clutch relays or the side stand relays doesn't go, you won't be able to flip the starter solenoid. I had one of those relays stop working because of dirty connection to it, even though the switches were fine.

That's what I try, anyway.

Sean

 

Now that you mention it, I noticed the same thing (multiple stabs) before I started working on the bike. I had originally attributed it to a wonky clutch switch, but now I'm thinking it was the same thing you had.

Thanks! I'm following your thread as well.

 

Thanks Sean!

I'll have a go at it tonight after work and report back.

 

One quick question:

Can anyone point me to where the relays are for the sidestand and clutch and how to test them to see if they are working?

Thanks!

Awesome Forum!

 

if your machine is like this 81, this (to me) utterly redundant relay is under the tank, towrds the rear. look for a relay with R&W, black w/ yellow trace, & light blue....it is tied to the clutch , sidestand, and neutral safeties....away with them ALL, thats what Id do if it were mine.......

 

With your help, I ran a few more diagnostics.

I shorted the starter solenoid and the starter cranked, so starter is OK.

I disconnected the safety relay and tried to start...nothing. By the way, the clicking I hear near the center of the tank at the frame when I switch from off to run is that relay. Does that tell me anything? About one second after I turn the switch back to off, I hear another click that sounds like it is coming from exhaust port number one...what the hell is that?

I checked continuity between ground (black) and blue/white at the connector for the right control. When start button was pushed, circuit was closed. So I know the button is OK. One weird thing about that connector is that there is a black wire pin on the control side, but no matching pin or wire on the harness side. So the black wire from the start button assembly goes to nothing. What's the deal there? Shouldn't it be grounded? I tried using a jumper from the ground wire to negative battery and pushing the start button and still nothing.

As you can tell, I'm a real noob on this electrical stuff, so thanks for you patience and help.

 

the black wire at the pushbutton is a ground....so, you should have continuity between that wire, the black one, and the frame or neg batt terminal. if not, youve found the problem....
A lot of electronic ignitions give a final spark when you turn them off- maybe thats what you are hearing.
hey, Im NOT untutored when it comes to bike electrics, & this insanely complicated arrangement got me pretty baffeled. Im off to energize the starter relay- the one under the side cover that actually passes the current to the starter. Look up at my thread & you'll find excellant directions for doing so. I hope it dont work- Ill have the problem solved, if thats the ONLY failure. Sometimes, against all odds, TWO things can go out at once, raising the complication by an order of magnitude.....but there is certainly top notch help at this site...

 

Here's a How-To you two inspired me to write...

How To: Test your starter circuit

Hope it helps!

 

The really weird part is that it was working before I disassembled the controls...I didn't mess with the connectors at all...there is no dangling black wire on the harness, so where in the hell did the ground wire disappear to. Also, I tried jumping the ground to the neg terminal and that still didn't do the trick.

Thanks for all of the help. We'll get this licked somehow!

 

Gamuru,

You rock! I can't wait to go home and run through your flowchart!

This damned job of mine makes it really hard for me to spend all of my time playing in my garage...

someday....

Thanks again!

 

UPDATE:

New bars came in and I installed the control housings on them and all of a sudden, the start button works.

I had wondered about the dead end ground wire from the housing that didn't have a match on the harness.

Turns out that the handlebars are the ground for my start button. I can't imagine that is the original design, but again, there is no corresponding ground wire on the harness side to mate up with the ground wire from the start button at the harness connector.