When is a Bike Old?

I notice that somebody wrote in that they loved this site because they loved "old" bikes. Have our ideas of "old" bikes changed, or is it just because I'm now a bit of an antique myself?

In 1967, I rode a 1951 AJS Model 18 500 single. It was a real old clunker. (Didn't stop me having a great deal of fun on it!) Cast iron cylinder, rigid rear end, manual advance/retard, separate magneto and generator, pressed tin primary chainguard, Lucas electrics (sometimes) and I used to do the timing and tappets every Saturday morning. My point is, it was only 16 years old, but it was hopelessly out of date and falling apart only slightly more slowly than I could put it back together. It was both transport and a full-time hobby!

In 2008, I ride a 1984 XJ900F. It's fast, comfy, handles well, has all the gadgets I need, is reliable and makes perfectly sensible everyday transport, even though it's eight years older than the AJS was!

Am I the only one that feels the boundaries have moved in the last quarter century?

 

A bike is only old when its no longer taken care of and no one wants it. Some may grin at my 1980 XJ 650 but it keeps going were now up to 150Km. How many of the modern bikes will be arround in 27 years? The bounderies haven't changed that much but todays disposable everything attitude pervades all that was good, there is always something better ,which costs more!
For all the hype modern bikes are just reicarnation copies of the XJ s.
If yamaha made the XJ again with modern technology and the robustness of the original I might consider getting one.
Bike on

 

Can you pass us some of those drugs you're on there buddy? 8O

 

When you are too old to get on a bike, then it's too old. Most bikes never die, they just get reserected back to life!

 

I think of my bike is old (it is older then I am). After riding a nearly new bike I realize how out of date the suspension on our bikes is (just one example) but in 27 years I hope they made improvements! I keep my bike in nice shape and am not ashamed to ride an old bike, I just make sure I keep a picture on it in my wallet and on my phone. People ask what I ride and when most of them hear a “Yamaha XJ750” they have no idea what it is but after seeing the picture, most don’t think it is really an ’81. Sometimes it’s fun having an “old” bike…. I got some nice reactions when I would tell people 2 years ago about my cross country trip… that I took on a 25 year old bike.

 

Yeah I call a bike old when it's older than I am (as is my 83 Seca).

Doesn't mean I don't love the thing.

 

I prefer to think of my old bike as "vintage iron" : )

 

my bike is just as old as i am we were both produced in 1982 though i dont consider myself old the bike is getting there. i hope to get a yamaha fz1 sometime but dont plan on getting rid of my xj650rj

 

You know, this is an interesting, thought-provoking thread.

Forgetting for a moment any problems that may have arisen from age, how are current bikes better than say, my 81 XJ?

This is a serious question: I like old cars, too. But I'm not kidding myself that a new Chevy pickup isn't way easier to live with than my restored 56. New cars have better mileage, brakes, steering, crash protection and lots more.

But is the same true of bikes? Is a belt drive model better than the shaft drive on my XJ? I've had zero problems there? What about other stuff? (Again, I'm temporarily ignoring that an old worn part couldn't give more trouble than a new one.)

Once an old Brit biker, I wanted less vibration. My Max is okay on that. (though modern suspension may be better)
And I like electric starting. But again, the 81 has it and it works fine.

I'm not saying there aren't improvements in newer bikes, just curious what they are. (carburetion/FI probably one area)

 

Better? I'll bite.

I had a maxim. I loved it. It did everything well.

That being said I now ride a 2000 CBR 600 F4. The suspension is far superior (go figure), the gas range is better, the seat is as comfortable, the wind protection is superior, the brakes are superior, and no questions asked the right hand controls are stronger.

Is it a better bike? Define the measure of a good bike.

For racing? CBR
For long distance? Surprisingly, I prefer the CBR - fits me better, better protection, better fuel range.
For stopping? CBR
Commuting? Maxim
Character? Maxim

Depends what you want... I would love a maxim again. I would commute on it. I would tour locally on it. I wouldn't pick it to goto NY over my CBR today though.

When is a bike old? 2 years in the sportbike world, 15 years for a cruiser...

The maxim has the heart of a sportbike and the looks of the cruiser... so 2*15 = 30 years... so it's not old yet!

 

Some of the more obvious improvements are:

Improved suspension
Improved brakes (drum brakes?? EEK!)
Liquid cooling
Fuel injection
Fusing/reliable "electrics"
Ergonomics (ie. the "cruisers" of today typically are much more comfortable in both the rider position and the quality of the saddle...in my opinion)

The biggies to me are the cooling and the disc brakes that all bikes have nowadays.

Now, if you want to talk "what makes a bike old", I would say bikes with points, magnetos and kickstart-only are old! Points. Ack.

 

Shafties are great... next to no maintenance really.

FI is good when it is working, but a carb'ed bike can be fixed road side and will limp a long time before dieing.

 

any bike 10 years old or more is 'old'..

new to me is still that 1-9 year range.

Mine being an 82, but turbo'd... I wouldn't trade my old bike for anything.

But I do plan on getting new (2008) bikes.

as far as better, the kids now-a-days do alot more damage to bikes than before. Not saying before wasn't bad either.

really, in the end, it's your ass on the seat, and your hands on the bars.

if you like older bikes, ride em, if you like newer bikes, ride em.

A bike is a bike, and as long as they are cared for, will last a long time. Kids these-days don't know how to take care of stuff because, if they break it, insurance writes it off and they get a new one. Sad thing is, if a small scratch happens or such, insurance will total it and give it salvage title.

 

any bike 10 years old or more is 'old'..

new to me is still that 1-9 year range.

Mine being an 82, but turbo'd... I wouldn't trade my old bike for anything.

But I do plan on getting new (2008) bikes.

as far as better, the kids now-a-days do alot more damage to bikes than before. Not saying before wasn't bad either.

really, in the end, it's your ass on the seat, and your hands on the bars.

if you like older bikes, ride em, if you like newer bikes, ride em.

A bike is a bike, and as long as they are cared for, will last a long time. Kids these-days don't know how to take care of stuff because, if they break it, insurance writes it off and they get a new one. Sad thing is, if a small scratch happens or such, insurance will total it and give it salvage title.

 

I got the bike I did because I wanted a cheap beater on which to learn how to ride. I thought of my bike a just that, a cheap ride and not very special. Then I was at a gas station fuelling up and this guy came over. He started gushing about my bike and what a classic it was. I said "it's not that old." He said, "it's 25 years old man." But the way he said it was a compliment. Like it was something worth preserving. Since that day, my bike has seemed much more shiny and special. It gets lots of TLC now.

 

"Beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

No bike is too old.
Only the one that got beat on and don't run well any more.

But, you never know who will buy it and fix it up.
It a disease.
Highly contagious!

 

I wasn't really thinking about "When is a bike worn out?" I was thinking about when is it old-fashioned in design and concept.
The newest road bike I've ever ridden was my 1993 FJ1200, and quite frankly, I didn't think it did all that much that the 1984 XJ900 doesn't. Faster, yes, but not much. Brakes no better. Much the same around corners. (My cornering speed these days is limited by the knowledge that when you're over 60 your bones don't knit all that fast, and my maximum road speed is governed by the fact that our police are a bunch of radar equipped killjoys.)
I kind of feel that if a mate and I set out on a 700km trip together, he on a brand new bike, me on the XJ, we wouldn't arrive all that far apart. On the other hand, if I were still riding the AJS, no matter how few miles it had on the clock, I think my friend might well have a spare day to enjoy the town he reached long before me.
I'm thinking back to the days when you didn't even ride around the block without a pocket full of spares and tools. I used to ride my G12 Matchless 650 about 250 miles each way at weekends to see what was then the girlfriend (and boy, did she get old fast when I married her!) and stuck in the saddlebags were tools up to and including a valve spring compressor!
My most important tool was the big pair of pliers I used to cut lengths of wire out fences, and then used to re-attached those bits of fine British engineering which had chosen to detach themselves from the bike.
I'll wager not many of us have exhausts held on with bent wire!
Bikes have really improved in my riding lifetime, but how much better have they become in the last twenty years?

 

The FJ's first came out in 84 (in 1100 guise), and design wise they didn't change much through to the end, so you haven't really ridden a "new" bike as such. My 2000 ZX9R Kawa is lightyears ahead of my old XJ900 on pretty well every aspect (except it's not quite as "comfy" for my 6'4" build).

Seriously, if you haven't ridden a Y2K+ sportsbike, you have no idea how far motorcycles have advanced in the past few years.

I'm not trying to be an ass here - but new bikes are just no comparison to 80's or 90's bikes. Go and ride an FZ1 or a Z1000 (because they have a more upright seating position) and you'll see what I mean.

 

If improved handling is achieved at the cost of turning the rider into a latter day Quasimodo, then I don't think it's a great step forward! (Nor am I impressed by bikes that elevate the passenger about a foot and a half above the rider! Have you ever looked at the pillion pegs on an MT-01?)

 

That's why I mentioned the FZ1 or Z1000 - they are nakedbikes with a much more rational seating position.

But if you want to carry a pillion, you don't want a sportsbike anyway.

 

kawa zx9R not comfy? with my roughly 6'7" i like my '98 ZX9R way beter for comfort than the XJ...

 

You must have pretty short legs... :lol:

 

"But if you want to carry a pillion, you don't want a sportsbike anyway."

Have another look at my avatar and ask yourself if you want to carry a pillion or not.

 

well, my GF prefers the kawa above the XJ as being passenger...
don't know exactly why...

 

You mean you've got 4 bikes and you don't let her ride any of them? :lol:

 

have two bikes, XJ and Kawa ZX9R
she doesn't have bike license... yet, she own's the car

 

Hillsy, this is a family friendly forum, so I won't explain the advantages of a pillion passenger! Let's just say it's nice to have warm shoulder blades!

 

Umm, I meant to ask Big Ross - but thanks for the update

 

that, plus riding an AJS 500 single? My cap is off, mate... You are quite a man!

yes, that is essentially what I was also asking some posts earlier. I have a 650 Max that is mechanically near-mint. Reliable, disc brake, electric start... What improvements would I gain from having a new model bike?

That wasn't a rhetorical question; I truly wonder what significant "quality of ride" issues may have arisen.

Sounds as though newer suspension may make smoother riding, and a proper FI could be simpler to live with. But, as a now-occasional sport rider (no long hauls anymore), I'm not certain there is much else to gain.

 

when you have to work on it more than you actually ride it.

 

Wait...thats a Harley. Harleys are old even when they are new!?

 

hey speak for your own kids im 17 and i had to buy my own cheap insurance and i cant just write off my crashes i have to fix it by myself. obviously you old timers only pic out a few but alot of us kids own old bikes and maintain better than you do cause there the only freedom we got. dont single out kids either ive seen 50 year old guys on new sportbikes lay em down as much as kids. and im a kid and i dont break stuff cause i took the initiative to learn how to ride on my own and i know my limitations. so the next time you rant about kids being bad on bikes get your facts strait.

 

i would say my bikes old but i loe it not only cause its my first but because older motorcycles are easier to fix on your own. besides its got loads of character and potential!

 

well my son has a bike, and he's 2 years old.. not a bicycle, a motorcycle. the little Razor PR200's.

as far as what you do? right on, as far as what the "kids" here do, that's all i know, and remember, i'm a kid too. I'm not and old fogie.

I doubt you maintain your bike better than me. It's your only freedom, but it's my life. Not only that, everything I do reflects upon my business, so everything has to be in tip top shape with the best care taken.

Sure, when i get a newer sports bike, i'll do a wheelie or two. Infact i'm pretty sure i'll be doing more than that.

I ride illegally though, no insurance. I don't believe in paying for someone else for a card, then having to pay them some more when i have an accident. I wreck, I have to fix. Out of pocket money. Which instead of paying to insurance, i pay to my savings account. Sure if I get pulled over i'm screwed, but don't do anything illegal infront of cops, and you won't get pulled over!

Just remember, because your "17" and "responsible" doesn't mean everyone is. Hell i know someone older than me, who stunts on sports, and if he wrecks he buys more. Now his job is less than "legal", and he has lots of "money". I also saw some kids in a bike shop looking for sports bikes, mommy and daddy was buying them one. Which is how it is around here.

 

One thing that should always brighten a young rider's heart...

Yeah, a lot of us older riders can be pompous old fogies (I have my own days like that).

And we sometimes put down young riders for doing the same things we did at the exact same age. (Sometimes we're being hypocrites and shouldn't that; sometimes we've lost buddies and don't want that to happen to anyone else.)

But the thing for young riders to remember, and grin about... when an old f*rt like me lays down my bike, I'm gonna ache, and limp, and whine a lot longer than you will. Yeah, I was a hot dog racer, dirt and track. And I don't apologize for that, though I mighta done a few things differently if I knew I was gonna wind up now with more rebuilt parts on my body than on my bike.

So can we make an XJBikes deal? Please be patient when we old goats tell you stuff you don't need to be told, and please also remember we say some of it because we think you're worth a lot and deserve years of safe, healthy riding.

just my $.02

 

From the airline world, the saying goes:

There are OLD pilots,
And there are BOLD pilots,
But there are no old, bold pilots........

Cause they end up mangled or dead.

And in my mind, being mangled for life is much worse than being dead.

No one is in control of events and situations as much as they'd like to think that they are!

 

one thing I started to realize as of a few years ago: the older you get, the more you realize how little you actually know. Experience is everything :mrgreen:

 

i love the older mens input but im young and all i have of my own in my large family is my bike....so it in anessence is my life too. i know you guys werent tryin to come down hard on the younger members i just thought i would stick up for the young ones like me who do take care of their bikes. \/

"turbobike"
as far as the whole kids thing goes i fet what your saying but as far as your taking care of your bike i can agree it reflects my buisness as well since the only money i get is what i make and i have to earn all my money from what i know which is working on trucks cars and bikes. so i have to keep mine looking as good as possible to keep my customers coming back.and even though im 17 its my daily driver to school and that is my life i want to finish school just like you want to get to work.

and to the old fogies i love hearing the old stories of the illegal street racing you can message me anytime it gives me the hope that one days the streets will be as lenient as back in the day. and its fun to see older guys getting into stunt riding, it puts their experience back into the levels of the youth.
bottom line im not bagging on anyone i just think some kids who try hard with their bike dont get the respect or the recongnition we deserve.

 

THAT is the key statement and a mature one. Most reckless people don't know their limitations, regardless of their age.

People who don't have as much experience ("time"), whether due to age or how long they've been riding (or driving, or flying a plane, or operating a frontend loader, whatever) USUALLY do not know their limitations, simply because they haven't had the chance to push the envelope enough times and learn what their limitations are.

Of course, the very process of "pushing the envelope" entails risk, and some people feel that they are infallible, and above it all. Us old fogies like to refer to such people as "dangerous" and "not long for this world".

And it's not just your own envelope that's being pushed. Motorcycling, no matter how far into observing your own limitations you might be, is inherently dangerous. What would be a fender bender in car becomes a broken skull and visual impairment, or mental impairment for life on a bike. Trying picking up chicks with that sort of handicap........

Allstate (the insurance company) had a recent series of ads on TV where they show someone driving down the street (in-car camera type of shot), maybe it was a woman turning to talk to her daughter next to her, or a guy reaching down to change the radio station for a brief moment, and just as they are returning their attention to the road, BANG! they're smashed head-on or from the side by another vehicle. The commercial is rather dramatic to watch because the viewer is put into the position of feeling "in the scene", and the unexpectedness and violence of the crash is astounding.

Trust me, from someone who's has been there: what is portrayed in those commercials is EXACTLY how it happens: tooling along, everything fine, a fraction (millisecond) of recognition of "something's wrong", and then boom.

Same thing with "pushing the envelope" without a CLEAR and VERY CONSERVATIVE APPRECIATION of what you, your bike's, and the combo of you, your bike, and everything else's contribution to what the true limitation really are, or could be.

 

i have crashed but never on the street to find out what i can do after around every two weeks of riding or so i go to a parking lot and set up some cones or use the planters and just push myself to the limit to see how much better my skills have become. to me i dont need to show off to someone just being on one at my age is enough i work hard at skill for the spots it comes in handy like swerving to avoid an accident. i practice it and i know that i can only go so far and only so fast till i do crash. i am confident the way i ride wil save my life one day. i know how to have utmost respect for the road......and besides they built tracks to go fast or pull stunts its the new age if you want to ride the best way is cool,slow and easy. save wheelies and the racing for the track.

 

Blackjack, you are one smart puppy...........!

 

its deffinently not in the genes ive just learned the hard way a couple times and by this age have grown smart enought to know when its time to ride and time to have fun. .......without killing myself.