Emergency mid-ride help **EDIT** Problem solved! see pg. 2

I am mid-trip (400 miles in at my brother’s place) and I need some help. The bike is getting 25mpg and has a lot less power then it should. It revs ok without a load but when moving it doesn’t have enough power, on the hi-way today it was barely able to go 75 mph. Then if there was a little uphill it wouldn’t hold the speed even if I gave it full throttle (although it was nearly there already).

Before it used to really kick in a 6k rpm and pull hard, now it's nothing special.

In the fall I had the carbs ultrasonically cleaned and I set the float height. Then this spring I balanced them (I did use a home-made YICS tool).

I think I set the floats correctly, at first the bike ran terrific, I put the regular tank back on and pinched the fuel line, after I fixed the line it didn't run as well. I tried balancing the carbs again but it still sucks.

The bike has 28,000 miles on it, I replaced the fuse box a number of years ago and the alternator brushes were replaced last week. It also rolls easily (brakes are not dragging).

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Drain the carb bowls. If a float is sticking the gas will keep coming, or be empty. If that is the case tap the outside of the carb with a screw driver and see if that changes the carb draining behavior.

If you have gas you have a chance.

The next test is to find out if it is running on all 4 cylinders. While running pull the spark plug boot off each plug, one at a time. If it doesn't change sound then that plug isn't firing.

Also - if you have a fuel filter, look at that obviously...

Sounds to me like a stuck float, a clogged needle, or a spark issue. Check the colour of the plugs if you get this far on the list.

David.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Floats don't usually stick mid-trip. I'll bet spark.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Floats did for us - because we were doing carb work before and stuff was still moving about... I think he said he was doing carb work before as well?

Anyhow - spark is a likely thing... esp if it was wet or very hot.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

check for a restriction at the airbox inlet,,,,seems I remember a story about a rag being stored over 1,,,,,,Dan

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

The bike wasn't running 100% at the start of the trip.....


Airbox looks good and the filter was replaced last summer, has a hit of gas smell but looks clean.

I pulled the plugs, #1 and #4 are black, #2 and #3 have alittle brown on the insulator and a little while/gray on the tip.

I checked the float height on #1, 4. Both had the fuel coming up to about 3 or 4 mm of the top of the bowl (checked with clear hose, bike off).

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Oh, I tried the color-tune, it seems that the pilot screws don't do much; I set them at 3 turns (they were at 1.5).

What do I check for a spark problem? I have new brushed but how do I test the alternator? What about the ignition coils? I see that the #1, 4 cylinders that seem to be giving the problem (looking at the plugs) also share the same ignition coil.

I have my Dad bringing a set of spare coils tomorrow, but we are meeting 200 miles away in Massachusetts. I then am supposed to be doing an Iron Butt 1000 mile ride on Saturday....

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

my thought is either coil or tci. But, have you tried playing with the choke cable while riding? You may slowly pull the choke on and see if it improves. That would tell you it's in the carbs or intake. Do you have access to a compression gauge? That would tell if you if you lost a ring or a valve.

let us know how things work out,

dave

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

You could try switching 1&4 plug wires with 2&3. If the problem moves to 2&3, then you have the problem narrowed down to one coil or two plug wires.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Ok, I know you aren't inclined to look this way 1st but it is the easyest.
1st do you have an inline fuel filter? I could be plugging or restricting flow!?
2nd you said that after pinching the fuel line it didnt run as good, I'd check that fuel line again and the way that (possible) fuel filter are set up. Sometimes a filter at the wrong angle can cause trouble.

I have to wonder if you didn't get some crappy liquid gold (GAS)
Latley I keep seeing this happen.

If you got bad gas and didn't have a fuel filter the little screens under your floats seats might be plugged.

If you dont have an inline fuel filter........ PLEASE!!!! Get 1

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

After I pinched the fuel line I bought a new 90 degree filter which still looks good. I don't think it was a bad tank of gas because I had to fill up 5 times.

Choke cable looks fine, I remember leaving the coke on a couple of years ago and it ran alot worse. Is there a way for the coke to be sticking partly on in just carbs 1 and 4?

I don't have a compression gauge here.


I am going to try swapping the plug wires on my way out to get some new plugs. I know it's just a Band-Aid fix but is it ok if I run a hotter plug in the outside cylinders?

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Try this when engine is cold. Start it for 10 seconds and feel exhaust pipes to determine which cylinders aren't running. Then try new plugs in those that don't run.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Well I put in the next step hotter plug inthe outside cylinders and it is running better and I am up to 34 mpg. It still isn't right but I will still go on the 1000 mile ride tomorrow. I am bringing a pair of even hotter plugs (2 steps hotter then stock) and I will try those if needed.


Is there a way to tell if I am using too hot of a plug (besides melting pistons)?

Lets hope!!!

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

If you are within striking distance to me ... In Billerica, Massachusetts ... I'll offer you the complete use of all my tools and garage space to work on the bike.

I have Carb Sticks, Colortune and Tools for both Mikuni and Hitachi.
Close to a Dealer
Close to a Auto Parts store.

Be sure to do a "Blow-through" inline fuel filter check. When I was ialing-in my 900 I had a cheap Inline Filter shut-off Fuel Flow.

If you get into a bind, I'll do whatever I can to help.
I'm rewiring a Coil and could have it ready to replace a bad coil of yours in an hour.

Billerica is close to where Interstate 495 and Route 3 Intersect.

Call information for Billerica, Massachusetts
I'm in the book.

Richard E. Massey
9 Stafford Lane

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help needed!!!

Thanks for the help guys and Rick that is a very generous offer... The XJ community is a good one.


I ended up running hotter plugs and that helped so I successfully completed the Iron Butt ride and made it home. I will work on the bike week so there will be more questions coming... I'm thinking it's a bad coil.

Right now I have stock # plugs in the center cylinders, 1 step hotter in the right, and 2 steps hotter in the left. The center plugs look good and the right looks ok but the left is still black. It sounds like the engine has a little skip in it but it is hard to hear so I am not sure. But is has a lot less power then it should. After a few hundred miles I have to run wide open in order to stay at 75 mph. I changed the #1 plug and it will be better for a while (still low on power but I can do 80+ if I need and not have to run wide open). Tomorrow I will check the valves since it has been a year then I will also do a search for ignition and stator testing. Unfortunately I don't have my repair manuals here so I will be leaning on you guys, I would like to get it fixed before I ride another 400 miles back to the apartment in 2 weeks.

Well after 1800 or so miles in the last 4 days I am going to bed.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

Sleep tight!
18-Hundred Miles!!!

Bike must be running pretty good for that.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

No not running all that great but $30 in spark plugs and lots of gas (30 mpg) kept it going.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

If you wound-up exchanging Plugs often that is a sure sign that either your Mixtures need tweaking or you have something going-on that fouls the Plugs.

I would hope you are able to fine-tune the Mixtures and get it running where it needs to be without Plugs of differing heat ranges and such.
It's tough to get Dialed-in when you have Plugs of different heat ranges.

Maybe you have some oil sneaking in there.
I hope not.
But, that factor cannot be overlooked if you are fouling Plugs.
Valve seals.
Maybe rings.
A Compression Test would help shake that down some.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

Rick is right on the money. Hotter plugs are harder to foul. By running hotter plugs you get more time before your problem fouls them.

Since your mileage is crap my bet would be you're getting too much fuel for some reason. And I don't think you can get enough extra fuel from the pilot circuit to foul them at speed. You need to look at fuel level, main jets and passages. Emulsion tubes. Jet needles.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

Did you de-oxidize the Bores when you cleaned the Carbs.

Stuck Diaphragm Pistons will wreck havoc on mileage and foul Plugs.
It's something that can be limited to one or more Carbs; too.

If the Diaphragm Piston is sticking Open ... even slightly, you are goind to be running overly Rich at the lower rpm's and sticking a hotter Plug inthere might mask the problem and keep it running.

See that the Pistons are rising and falling without binding or you might have one stuck ... check for that; too.

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

When I cleaned the carbs. I checked the diaphragms and they looked good, the pistons worked smoothly and the bore looked good although I didn't take the time to polish them. I really, really don't want to take the carbs off again, the worst job on these bikes is putting the carbs on.

I have a new problem though, I took the bike out today and 100 yards later the rear end went out on me. I will be spending tomorrow in the garage to figure out what went wrong. More to come tomorrow...

 

Re: Emergency mid-ride help **UPDATE** Thanks for the Help

figured it out...

I Tested the ignition coils and the one for the #1,4 cylinders tested bad. I tossed on a spare, screwed on my new caps, and tested it... it was bad too! So I tested the original coil again with some old caps... it was fine!

Yes my new $5 NGK caps were the problem, the inside ones work fine but the outside ones (all are new) don't work right.


I also found out why my rear end gave out, the bolts holding the driveshaft to the output shaft came out. They chewed up the swing arm a little bit but new bolts lock-tight in seem to work fine.