REALLY dumb question...plug wires (NEW info)

I'm secong guessing myself on the routing of the plug wires. I numbered them with a marker as I took them off. Now I notice the little white wire number bands on the wire. I marked 2 and 3 backwards from what the bands say. I know that the bands could be wrong but I want to verify anyway.

As I sit on the bike facing forward:

Cylinder 1 is on my far left.
Cylinder 2 is center left
Cylinder 3 is center right
Cylinder 4 is on my far right.

The left coil fires 1 and 4
The left wire in the left coil is #1
The right wire in the left coil is #4

The right coil fires 2 and 3
The left wire in the right coil fires #2
The right wire in the right coil fires #3

Do I have this figured correctly?
It's been a long mind-numbing day and I don't want mistakes.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

you got the numbering right, the leads should be different lengths (clue)

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

left or right doesn't matter the smaller primary leads fire the coils
orange wire to the coil for 1+4
gray wire to the coil for 2+3

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

That threw me for a sec. I've just realized that I have two right coils.

Both of them have the gray wire. I traced the wiring of the left one back to the connector and sure enough the gray wire becomes orange there.

Is there ant difference in spec (other than wire color) between the two?

I got the orange/gray thing figured. Now, for the 1&4 coil, which plug wire goes to which plug? Ditto for the 2&3 coil, which wire to which plug.

I can get it to start for short bursts. Then, it shuts off like I hit the kill switch. It's been rainy all day. I haven't had the bike out in it. Could humidity be giving me coil issues?

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

no
the plug leads are interchangeable 1/4 or 4/1 same for the other coil 2/3 or 3/2

what is a short burst? 10 seconds, 30, a minute
why do you feel it's a electrical problem ?
after it starts up and then dies, use common sense, and touch the pipes to find which ones are working

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

It don't matter.
Both fire simultaneously!
Together.

They help you make it easy for the wires to reach the Plugs.
One wire is longer than the other one.

So, the Plug furthest from the Coil gets hooked-up to the long wire.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

Thanks on the plug wires. Now, I understand they fire at the same time. I'll leave it as is if there is no difference in the coils.

The only reason "electrical" came up was because of the fact that there was no sputter before it died. It dies as if I hit the kill switch. Just wham and its off.

The amount of time that it runs before it shuts off varies. At first it would run 2 or 3 seconds then die. Just now, it ran for a good 4 or 5 minutes then died. It got warm enough to shut the choke all the way off. When it dies like that, it won't want to restart right away. I have to shut off the ignition and wait a few minutes.

The carbs are bench synced with the idle screw at 2.5 turns. So, isn't really "tuned". All I changed about the bike today was the valve shims (the PO had them way too tight) and I did the cam tension adjustment for non automatic tensioners. I also cleaned the spark plug holes with a spark plug hole cleaner.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

that sounds like a duff coil.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

I'm thinking the same. I just noticed the bit of electrical tape where the #1 plug wire meets the coil. Thats one of the odd wires too. It has a boot that says NGK on it. The rest don't. Since I already know the left coil is actually a "right" coil, I'm guessing the PO bodgered the wire. It was working fine but then, I moved the wire all around. Now, Im betting the loose/taped wire is losing contact and killing the engine.

Isn't funny (by funny I mean SUCKY!! ), how everytime something gets fixed, some OTHER problem rears its head. Weird. Why don't things ever go wrong at the same time instead of this endless "one thing after another" schtik. I SOOO need to get this thing working reliably and predictably.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

that's called LIFE conn

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

feel the pipes, if all 4 are hot that can almost rule out the coils(both coils won't crap out at the same time)although the TCI could take them both out
if ya got a 1/4, 2/3 thing going on with cold pipes, that could be a coil
consider making up a axillary fuel supply, that eliminates any fuel supply problems
next best thing for trouble shooting is use prime on the fuel valve, make sure you have good flow, and don't forget to put it back to "run" when your done

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

It'll get there. Eventually, I'll have repaired or replaced everything. Maybe, someplace between fixing everything and everything starting over again, I'll get to ride it.

Tommorrow, I'll see what's what with the coil. Is there a test or anything for them?

Polock, will do. I'll check them tommorrow.

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

Simple test.
All you have to do is swap the Plug-in's from the Coils to the Wiring Harness.

If you have a problem with 1 or 4 ... and, 2 and 3 are OK ... when you swap the Plug-in's the problem should swap, too.

1 and 4 should be OK ... and, the problem shifts to 2 or 3.

If that happens ... you have a bad Coil.
Simple as that!

 

Re: REALLY dumb question...plug wires

set your multimeter to ohms & probe the low tension wires you should read 2.5 ohms + or - 10%
set m.m to kilo ohms scale & probe HT leads should read 11 Kohms + or - 20%.

 

I tested coil resistance.

Primary
Low 2.9 ohms
High 24.2K ohms

Secondary
Low 0 ohms (yes, as in NONE)
High 24.3K ohms

Time for new coils. Yes?

Oddly, when it runs, it runs on all 4 cylinders. Then it just suddenly dies.
I think the short on the secondary occurs when the coil warms up a bit. I've seen this happen in auto coils.

I guess the plug (high) wire side on both is just too high and out of spec.

 

After a "cooled off" measurement, the secondary low tension reading is 2.8 ohms. It seems my theory about shorting when it warms up is correct.

Also, after removing the resistor caps on the plug wires, the high tension wires on both coils reads 11k ohms as they should.

 

I want to be clear on what you mean by primary and secondary resistance measurements.
What I am referring to as primary is the pig tail that is pluged into the wiring harness. You should read between those two blades. This reading should be 2 to 3 ohms max.
For a secondary test, you should read about 11k (more or less) from one of the Primary connector blades to the end of a spark plug line that has been unscrewed from the spark plug boot.
Confirm your observations please.

 

You are correct, I misused terminology in one of my earlier posts.

I wrote it as if the left coil was primary and the right coil is secondary.

In fact, the primary measurement of either coil is taken at the "low tension wiring" or "pigtail" as you suggest.

We differ on the secondary measurement though. My Haynes manual (pg 144) says that the secondary measurement is made at the two ends of the spark plug wires. So, remove both boots from the spark plug side wiring and put one of your multimeter probes into the un-booted end of each wire.

What the book fails to mention is that to get the 11k ohms reading you must remove the resistor caps and test the bare wires. I found that tidbit on the net.

 

that is correct if you are running caps with resisters, not if you have resisters in your plugs.

 

so what your saying is that both coils get hot together and quit at the same time, i find that odd