Forward Controls & Tractor Seats

Hey everyone,

I just went on a 4 hour ride the other day and realized that the XJ is not too comfortable for me on a long ride. My legs started cramping from them being under my hips, and my seat is very slick and likes to slide me forward toward the tank when riding.

I am about 6'2" and I was wondering about forward controls. I know TC Bros has a set for the XJs, any taller riders use these? Do you find that they are forward enough? Looking where my engine guards are (where the forward controls go I think) doesn't seem like they would be...

Also, anyone have any good sources for tractor seats for the XJ?

Thanks!

 

I'm 6'4". Same issues you describe.

I found my tractor seat at an antique store in Southern VA on my honeymoon. I built my own forward controls and they are farther out then the engine mounts.

 

Thanks iwingameover! Do you have any pics so I could see your set up?

With your seat, are you stock as far as your frame and airbox?

 

I have a build thread on here someplace.

The frame is stock with the airbox. I got a large hinge and welded a piece of flat stock to it. Seat bolts to the flat stock. Other half of the hinge is welded under the rear tank mount. It flips forward to get at the fuses and air filter. Though I usually just pull the hinge pin and take it off.

 

I like the sound of that, I was thinking of something similar but was worried the seat may look too high.

I will take a look around for your thread on your forward control set up. Thanks for the help man!

 

I'll just leave this here: http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=22150.html

iwingameover's forward controls thread, just in case anyone stumbles on this thread looking.

 

Hey guys, same here I'm 6'2'' I have no problems with the controls, my problem is with the seat. I'm planning to take some foam off from the seat to lower it down. Try this... remove the seat and seat down in the bike and you'll feel how nice it could be, even for your lower back. Also, If you can post some pics, thanks

 

I'm actually looking into making my own seat.

Check this out: How to make a fiberglass seat pan

Looks pretty easy! Supplies wouldn't be that much either.

 

For those of you who find the seats too cramped (I'm also 6'2"), consider this - every MSF or Condon book instructing riders says that the best street riding position is for the feet to be in-line with the hips for better control and shock absorbing. Many say they like forward controls, but there is no way you can use your knees for additional absorbtion/control if you hit any bumps/potholes or you need to make a quick maneuver. And if you don't construct an extra-wide/properly-padded seat to adequately support your entire weight, you will end up with back problems too.

Through some trial and error on my part, I've found that most of the newer dual-sport bikes fit me best (Suzuki DL650/1000, BMW GS, Triumph Tigers, etc.). They have this relationship, but also have a higher-than-XJ seat. The distance you should be looking at replicating is about the same as your pants inseam (33" for me). Build up your seat to this height (using better foam material), raise the bars so that your forearms are more level and your wrists are at an angle that doesn't promote carpal tunnel syndrome.

Some additional resources.
Moto Ergo to see how you fit on a whole lot of different bikes.
DIY Motorcycle Seat good guidance on construcing your own.
Rider magazine article at Spencers to get an idea of how he does it (Spencers has many endorsements on the AdvRider forum).
Supracor material used by Spencer.

 

In regards to hip placement and such,, each rider is going to be different. besides, I dont know many people who are buying/building these types for long journeys. Most are just bar hoppers or bike shows. They are impractical for travel other than to look cool. So, I'm not sure why people are commenting about seat position and leg/knee/hip position other than what works for them for the way they ride the bike. period. thats what this is all about, customization, for yourself. and as far as being able to utillize your legs for shock absorption with forward controls, i do it every day on my road king. just just push up with your feet and pull with your arms a wee bit. all is fine.
now, as far as those tc brother models are concerned, they dont look like they will hold much weight for very long and after time, i'd be concerned about their ability to hold weight. there were discussions about the rotating of the lever to shift/brake could wear into the stem they rotate on. But for the price, and way people ride these bikes, might not be a bad deal.
i want a more personal homemade look and would prefer the designs that you have cut out of steel, punch some holes, put in some pins and spacers and build off of that. but then again, thats me, my customization! to each their own and god bless us for being free to do that!
i am doing my first bike and i'm sure somewhere above i stepped on my tater but hell, that'll be fun,, weasling out of it!
thanks for being so open on this site, the ideas and knowledge are awesome!

 

I'm 6'5" with long, gangly arms and legs. And I learned long ago that the concepts zap2504 brought up are the most applicable, at least to me.

My personal solution for all-day comfort was to have my seat recontoured and up-foamed while still appearing stock. The new seat profile provided me with a couple of more inches' worth of legroom, and lower bars (in my situation) got me un-cramped and into a more realistic riding position.

The result is a bike that I can ride all day without any discomfort whatsoever (and that says a lot since I'm also an old fart

 

Bigfitz, sweet looking ride!
I could never ride that thing for longer than 20-miles. my arms would become numb!! that is why i am staying away from the 'leaned-over'posture. i want to be upright, arms comfortably in front of me, relaxed, with hands between my shoulders and upper belly.
but thats why i said, its about each riders comfort level and style needs. personally, i dont mind feet being tucked under me, its the arms to the front and down with my body weight on them that gives me issues. and i'm an old fart too, lol, just with shoulder issues.

 

I ran a set of TC-Bros forward controls on my '81 Seca for a few years. I also swapped the stock bars for Drags and 4" risers.

I'm only 5'9" but a buddy who's 6'2" said he'd like the forward controls to be a few inches further forward. This could have been accomplished by switching them left for right.

My son took the bike back to stock(he's about 6'1") and we brought the stock bars down as low to the tank as possible and I have to say it was nearly as comfortable for me as it was with the FC and drag bars.

As far as the TC-Bros quality, I'd say they are well worth the price. There was no discernible wear to the control axises and they had absolutely no flex when installed. You'll want to do something with the finish but compared to cost of Kuryakyn controls... well, I'd say there's no comparison.

I may be putting mine on my newly acquired Maxim, which is the frame they were designed for. I want to work up a linkage that lets me keep the mid controls as well as run the forward set.

 

as soon as you go to forward controls you loose the ability to flex your legs to soak up a bump. then your spine takes a beating, good luck with that

 

Plus a "tractor" seat pins you in one spot, making shifting your position fore or aft a few inches impossible. Sitting in one, fixed position for extended periods also contributes greatly to fatigue.

 

Why are you all arguing over individual riding style? Bigfitz... if i am barhopping, around town usage ONLY ,, who cares about comfort?? Polock, look ahead, miss most of the bumps, easy enough , I do it EVERYDAY ON MY ROAD KING. I really wonder about the skill level of riders on this post??

 

Because this:

 

Here's the link to the Ken Condon article: Motorcycle Posture

If you want to look like the majority of the cartoonish "butt on the ground, arms in the air, legs out front" riders I see, then go for it. But if you want to enjoy riding your bike, want to be able to control it (and avoid crashes) when unforeseen events happen, want to get rid of sore muscles/joints after the ride - then follow the guidance. That's the reason the Long-Distance Riders can ride long distance. If you are just in the hobby for show, then trailer it to the watering hole, park it, and set up your folding chair on the sidewalk.

 

Some people have bad knees (like me) and need the forward controls. You can always keep the mid-pegs for those bumps that can't be avoided.
Sculpting the seat or changing seats can be a big help also.
We DON'T need to criticize others if their tastes are different from ours, we are supposed to be helpful.

 

Sgtduckyboy, maybe the roads are better in MO but here in PA we have these bumps that go all the way across the road, kind of like mini speed bumps, 3 inches high and 6 inches wide, the only way to miss them is go off the road.
come across one of those at speed at the apex then tell me about your ROAD KING riding skills

 

Route 5 east of Erie is so rough the US Army uses it to test tanks. Riding that road at 55 qualifies you for the PBR Finals in Vegas.

 

OnB - I contend that you DO NOT need forward controls, you need a seating position where your knee angle is much closer to 90 degrees on the standard pegs. This (probably) involves raising the seat several inches (quite possibly to equal your pants inseam measurement). Forward controls means all your weight is supported only by your tail bone (which will ultimately give you back problems), and you now have much less body control of your bike (no knee leverage). You also should have the seat sculpted so that it is WIDER than stock so as to better disperse your weight across a larger surface (the reason that Bill Mayer and Russell Day-Long seats are so comfortable).

Of course raising the seat typically means raising the handlebars (and maybe changing the front-rear dimensions) so your forearms are also horizontal and your seating angle is something like 7 degrees or less. Good riding position; bad look in other "Easy Rider" wanna be's eyes. See for yourself. Go to Cycle Ergo, select either the Yamaha 650 or 750 Seca (the Maxim versions used almost identical frames and riding positions are very similar), select your body dimensions under Rider Info, then modify the bike dimensions under Vehicle Customization (seat height, handlebar rise/pull-back, etc.) so that your knee bend is close to 90 degrees and your forearms are horizontal and the Forward Lean is 7 degrees or less. For me on a 750 Seca that means a 2.5" seat rise, 2" handlebar rise, and a NEGATIVE 2.5" handlebar pull-back (grips moved closer to the front).

Looks more like a dual-sport bike? There's the reason that dual-sport bikes have become so popular for people riding longer street distances than "bar hopping".

 

Roads are bad all over the country. Our tax dollars at work, or not. :lol:
I've been to the Ergo site. What I know for sure is that before I put forward controls on (I had back problems then), my lower back and knees hurt. After installing the forward controls, back didn't hurt as much and knees felt much better and could ride longer/further distances because I was more comfortable.
My brother has been a Harley/forward control rider for 35years. No back problems. He has ridden his bike to Sturgis and Yosemite from Mississippi with no problems.

 

Thanks for the cool article!

 

I have both a tractor seat and forwards. Once I get a bit of free time at home to put the carbs back on the bike from a leaking float needle, I'll ride however far someone wants to go, wherever and for however long.

 

iwingameover, got a pic of your setup?

 

Build thread is linked on the first page of this topic.