Legalities of re-stamping a frame number...

OK so I'm pondering something here. I've spotted a 31A frame for £140 delivered on the bay that I could use to rebuild my E-II (this all assumes the frame is still for sale next Tuesday when I get the money :? )

I'm wondering about the frame number though, this frame is a US import and has never been registered in the UK. A thought I had was that, seeing as it's never been registered under it's current frame number, could I legally flat off that number and stamp it up with the correct 29R designation as long as I notified DVLA of the replacement frame? I'm thinking it might be possible because if I were to buy a brand new unstamped frame (for example) then I could stamp it up, and this frame is "new" to the UK....

Like I say just a thought to try to retain the bike's original identity seeing as it's a rare model, there's no saying I'll even get this frame as knowing my luck someone else will buy it the day before I get paid haha... Anyway time will tell I guess, would be nice to keep it's identity.

 

You didn't hear this from me but.......

How would the DVLA know the frame was not the original if it is stamped up correctly?

If that's all you're worried about just tell no one!! Delete the post and say nothing.

Here in Ireland we have a healthy disrespect for the law when its just paperwork for paperwork's sake!

I repeat "Tell NO ONE!!"

 

Hey Bloke, glad to see you back online and hopefully recovering from the injuries incurred from the misfortune you mentioned in your other thread.

It may be possible to have a new VIN sticker made up for your 750 E-II and affix that to a "new" frame. Smooth out the original VIN and cover the area with the reproduction sticker. Leave yourself enough room to stamp the original VIN and maintain a matching numbers bike.

You will need some documentation to have this done, and here's the link to a company out of Canada does the stickers:
http://www.bdesigns.ca/Reproductions.htm

Tony

 

When your all done rebuilding this frame and making it real nice, what's to stop someone from stealing it and useing the same story and restamping another good number on it.

 

BDesigns requires several pieces of documentation to validate ownership before they will reproduce a sticker.

 

i would say chop the head tube, but then i remembered you said yours was ovalized.

hmmm..

got pics of the bike by chance?

 

Well I could obviously just stamp it up & say nothing but the point is I'm not out to deceive anyone (say for instance if I sold it it would affect value & morally I couldn't do that) so I was trying to find out if it could be done legally.

That said though, I could always just go that route & never sell it... Now there's a perfect excuse to keep her! Thanks Mick!

Yes the lower bearing race hole is oval mtnbike, I've not taken any pics since the accident but to be honest it's not visually dramatic anyway really the only things that would show up are the scuff on the fairing, crushed exhaust & snapped hanger. I might try to get a front on pic to show how far out of line the front wheel now is though... (weirdly, the forks are perfectly OK! think it's the way the car hit me, front wheel first but almost side-on, that made the frame twist so badly)

 

i was in the same position as you "Bloke", although i dont think mine was as bad as yours, but the headstock was twisted, but i managed to straighten it back up.



i used a longer scaffold pole and wedged the frame in my garage "pit" (its underneath the carpet in the picture) managed to get it as near as dam it, wheels now in line to a couple of mm.
could you get the oval headstock in a vice and squash it back round again?
stu

 

Yeah that's kind of how mine is bent (same direction) but where the distortion in your frame is seems to be all in the few inches of tube closest to the head tube, the downtubes on mine are actually kinked behind the oil cooler and the gussets to the side of that join are distorted too (folded sharp enough to flake the paint off).

I haven't really looked at the top tubes to be honest as I pretty much gave up on the frame when I saw the downtubes, but I'd lay odds that there's either kinks or cracks there too...

Thanks for the suggestion though & glad it worked out for yours, I still quite like the idea of having an excuse to never sell the bike though

 

Hey Bloke,

I wasn't thinking of trying to deceive anyone either. I was just trying to suggest a quick way of getting back on the road without all the hassle and paperwork required. If the frame is the same as the old one, no one need ever know, and the bike is still same as standard.

If you go the totally legal route, surely a frame swap will show on the DVLA records and reduce the sale value anyway.

Your bike, you decide. That's my motto anyway.

Best of luck either way.

 

I wouldn't worry about it. you know what you got + who cares if it isn't a 29R frame? Not like you are ever going to part with the bike anyway.... this just gives you a better reason not to.....

 

Thanks everyone, I should have figured I'd never be allowed to part with her anyway haha That's one of the many reasons I love this place, so much good advice & common sense to be found

 

Just don't tell anybody about changing a frame number. Are these the same people who think copying a PDF workshop manual is criminal.
Just asking

 

Most authorities don't care about vehicles 20 + years old, some States don't require titles, some places relax emission requirements, ETC.
The attitude is it must be worth less than $1,000 and as long as you are paying the annual tax, let it slide.

Congrats on getting the frame !! Tell Nobodies !!
Make a Japanese Windchime out of the old frame !!

 

What I would do is to go to the local vehicle authority and ask what is the procedure and requirement for retitling a bike with a frame replacement. Never know what they may say. They may title it with the number on the frame, allow it to be restamped with official proof to your old number, or they might issue a salvage title number to be stamped instead. Since you are not trying to hide anything, you have nothing to lose by just going to them and asking. Just my thoughts..

 

This thread is great.

The poor guy is in the UK, where motor vehicle regs apply to the entire country, and have within them some very interesting variations between uber-tight and don't give a damn depending on the subject. Plus once a vehicle has a license number, that is its license number forever, even if it changes hands.

But he's getting answers from us pack o'Yanks, who have 50 different sets of motor vehicle laws. Some states have inspections, some states don't care what it is if you can produce some sort of paperwork. Some states get all funny if they "lose track" of a vehicle for any period of time (Cali) some will let you put anything in the world back on the road without ever seeing it. (Mich.) About the only thing all the States have in common is that license plate numbers change all the time and are not "locked" to the vehicle, but generally the owner. So if it changes hands, especially from state to state, the license (and title) change. And every state has different titles and title regs.

Anybody familiar with the fable of the blind men and the elephant?

 

Haha yeah should've mentioned I'm in the UK but it slipped my mind, still some good advice/opinions on the matter anyhow & Mick in Ireland has probably the right idea as long as I keep the bike forever... Which, personally, I think is a great plan 8)