top fork plug is stuck

trying to rebuild the forks on my 82 650 Seca, after the forks are on the bench, step 1 - remove top dust cap and then remove metal ring and the plug should pop up from pressure. well, I got the ring out, but the damn plug is stuck down. I had to hammer the plug down to reveal the ring, as soon as the plug was Slightly lower than the ring, I proceeded to remove the ring, But, the damn plug just stays there. it's soaking in penetrating fluid now but doesn't look good.

Since my forks have no rust on them I'm sure many other owners have seen this problem. Please tell me there's a method to overcome this?

 

Yes there is. I went through the same thing until someone suggested: http://www.kanolabs.com/google/

I tried PB Blaster, JB80, Liquid Wrench, CRC--- nothing worked for like 8 months.

Kroil? Ten minutes.

TIP*** Don't hammer the caps down any further than just past the ring. The tubes is tapered on the inside and you'll jam them.

Also, loosen the upper triple tree clamp bolts to relieve any bind they might be creating. (Not applicable if they're off the bike already.)

But honestly. Kroil works when ALL others fail.

 

There is yet another way... I rebuilt mine not long ago and they were really stuck in there and rusted to the hilt.
Okay get a good 2 x 4 and place it on a concrete surface.....
Turn those forks upside down and wack it really hard on the 2 x 4. It may take several wacks and you want to hit them straight down as to not miss or to bend anything but it will work.
Got to muscle up dude and they will come out. That is how I got mine.
Now once you get them to the edge of the fork then you can put the spring back in etc. and hit it from the other direction to get it the rest of the way. However, it could shoot accross the room if you aren't careful so take it slow at this step.
Good luck.

 

i put a sturdy shop towel over mine and gave some taps with a rubber mallet. it was nice using the shop rag since it was pretty evident when the plug came out.

 

Yes, this is what I did also once I got it to the edge and started striking the bottom of the fork. Guess I should have explained this further. This is what meant by being careful about it at this step.

 

You could also try squeezing the fork in a bar clamp and let it sit over night. Under the extra spring pressure it might creep out.

 

yet there are third and a fourth ways! what a day man. and fitz, after reading your post I had kroil and let it sit for 20 mins, no chance.

ok, here's what I tried that didn't work. put the fork on a rag on the concrete garage floor, tried this with the fork flipped also. got a 4 ft 4x4, me and a friend pushed the 4x4 down until the fork bottomed out, and had a third guy SLAM the middle of the 4x4 where the fork was directly under teh wood, with a hammer. both sides, over and over, nothing, even after the kroil.

hey what happened to the 'advanced' reply posting, I was going to underline and bold the next segment.

what did work?
well since both plugs were stuck and we were screwed I said, F it, lets try to take the bottom allen bolt out, the first one came right out, couldn't beleive it. After staring at the fiche/diagram in the service book we realized it was a straight hollow shot all the way to the plug at the other end. We went to Home Depot, fork in hand, and bought a solid rod that fit in the hole of the damper rod. Got back to the garage and starting pounding on the rod and the plug finally came out.

Second fork, the allen bolt on the bottom kept spinning as expected so our 'solid rod poker' method was shot. My buddy said, screw it, now that we know the plug is solid metal, lets drill and tap a hole in it and put a slap hammer on it. with no other choices I was game. Just before spinning the drill I thought of something. Lets put the fork on the floor on a rag, you my friend compress the fork best you can and I'l try to spin the allen bolt. Maybe the pressure of the compressed spring will hold the damper assembly good enough to let me spin the bolt - it worked. then we used the solid poker rod to bang out the plug once again.

finally I had the spark plug socket upside down to hold the damper whilst re-inserting the bottom allen bolt with locktite and everything was good.

the only problem I had after that was getting the plug in to put the ring back in the groove at the top of the fork. So I wire-wheeled the plug and inside of the fork tube with a dremel and it worked then. I also stuffed a peice of paper towel in the leg before I dremeled to catch the crap I didn't want in the fresh oil, then picked it out with a long needle nose.

put it all back, bike rides like a dream

Thanks for all your input guys, I wasn't replying but was reading as we went. things were changing buy the minute and didn't want to post false or stupid questions.

Do I hear Sticky?

 

This thread needs to be revived and stickied... I used an impact gun with an allen key to get the spinny cap screw out the bottom, but I never thought to use a long metal dowel to pop that sucker out! Im trying this when I get home... thank the lord i found this thread, I was about to force a bolt into the npt thread at the top of my 82 xj650 air assist fork and make a new one haha

 

Reviving this because I had the same problem on the 1980 650 Maxim that I'm waking from a 20+ year nap. I will start by saying that I absolutely hate that (grawlix) system of using a circlip or snap ring to retain the upper plug--I had a Suzuki Water Buffalo back in the 1980s that had a similar system (snap ring rather than circlip) and I cussed the air blue every time I changed that beast's fork oil.

That said... I pulled the rubber caps and of course found rust underneath. Shot of PB Blaster and overnight rest. Next day I removed the bars (of course they're positioned to block access to the fork tops) and tried to press down on the caps. No movement. Gentle taps with hammer and socket extension yielded mixed results: the right one bounced on the spring, as it should. The left one went down... and stayed there. Uh-oh. That's when I stumbled upon this thread (which I agree ought to be stickied), and got to spend a couple days worrying that I had jammed the tapered plug into the tapered tube bore.

Today (after all the Labor Day weekend guests had left), I tried the procedure above, removing the fork tube and bashing it onto a hard-ish surface (rather than a 2 by 4 I used a piece of 3/8" polypropylene). Good news: the plug moved back to its resting position, blocked by the circlip. So now I had to remove the circlip. For this, I contrived a simple press out of stuff I had around the garage:



The fork tube is gripped by the lower tree. The eyebolt is just a convenient piece of threaded material. I drilled a hole in a piece of aluminum stock I had around because I couldn't find a fender washer. Turn the nut counter clockwise and the bolt pushes the plug down so the circlip can be pried out with a small screwdriver. I still needed an assistant... to hold a flashlight so I could see the clip in that dark hole! Maybe the next version of the tool will include an LED...

This enabled me to get the circlip out, but the plug still stopped about 1/16" below the top of the tube. At that point I put a rag over it and gave it a gentle tap with a hammer and extension, and it finally popped out. Had to do the same on the right side, which wasn't frozen but also wouldn't easily come out. I then spent the next couple hours cleaning up the tubes and the plugs with wire brush, (Harbor Freight imitation) Dremel tool, and fine sandpaper (I had a shop towel jammed down the tubes to catch grit and debris). I noticed the oil was different colors: the left side was gray-black, like it had been there a long time; the right was golden brown. I wonder if the previous owner had attempted to change the fork oil at some point and only succeeded on the right side!

I refilled the tubes with Bel-Ray 10W fork oil, inserted the springs (possibly upside down, though I doubt that particularly matters), and used my little press tool to re-install the plugs and circlips.

One more job done. I have already cleaned the gunk out of the carbs (after they sat with fuel in them for 20+ years--hint: 0.4mm acupuncture needles are really good at opening up those starter jets) and dismantled the front caliper (new piston arriving tomorrow). The bike's getting closer to being on the road, and I have still not spent a dollar per cc on it...

One more thing: I had a backup procedure up my sleeve, just in case the plugs were genuinely stuck: I have an air impact gun, and in my experience you can always get those lower fork bolts (the ones that hold the damper rod in place) out with an impact gun, especially if they have the pressure of the spring on them. The drain screw came out with ease. So my backup plan was to empty the forks through their drains, pull the damper rod bolts, and pump in fork oil with a syringe (allowing air to escape through the drain hole). Not ideal, but it would have allowed me to change the fluid. Luckily (perhaps because I had a backup plan), I didn't have to do this.

But I still think the circlip system is bogus.

 

clever solution

 

Agreed - that it a clever solution. I am going to try that myself, I think.

 

My fourth grade math skills lead me to believe the ONLY difference in orientation of the springs is to slightly reduce the unsprung weight. With the tight coil on the bottom, you will have a little bit more mass traveling up and down with the wheel. Its a difference that is technically correct on paper, and probably not measurable in the real world. But I'm guessing here.

 

I used a junk triple tree to disassemble some junk forks with this method. I 3D printed a plug/bushing to go into the upper part. Works much better than the janky system of clamps and crap I've used in the past.

 

Hmm, maybe not. The tight coils compress first, and that put more metal in the air pocket above the oil. If upside down the most metal will be down, pushing the oil up towards hydraulic locking the stanchion. Not sure if this is enough to make a difference though...

 

Hmmm, maybe so! With the tight coils compressing first, they might be down there churning the oil into foam with every little bump if installed upside down. We need somebody to 3D print a transparent fork tube for experimentation