1982 xj650rj SECA

I got a tip from another user who suggested that I create a thread for my bike that specifically includes history, progress, questions, and comments. This will save time for everyone else, and hopefully provide myself and others with answers to questions and provide helpful insights concerning the 1982 xj650rj SECA.

To start, my bike is a 1982 xj650rj SECA (pictured). The previous owner bought it from an old man with only 3,000 miles on the odometer. The previous owner wanted to make it a cafe type bike, so the frame was cut near the rear to accommodate a cafe style seat loop, but it was never finished, so it sits right now with a cut frame. When he purchased it, he was able to get it to turn over after looking inside the engine, and replacing all of the gaskets. He said that he had rebuilt the engine, but I don't know exactly what else he did other that the gaskets.I'm not sure why, but after he got the engine to turn over, he had attempted to re-wire the engine without a harness and never finished. he let it sit outside for about a year and then I bought it. a few big boxes of parts were included, and they will be of great benefit to the project.

My first step is to find out if we have a good motor. at first, I was planning on continuing to re-wire like the previous owner, but I was lucky enough to find a stock wiring harness on ebay.

On 12/23/17, My step dad and I pulled all of the previous owners custom wiring. I started labeling the stock harness connections based on an original wiring diagram. We found that the sub harness was still in tact, and there were a lot of original harness connections used in the re-wire, so we pig tailed them and labelled them for future connection to the harness.

If you have any questions, concerns, or comments, please share them. My stepdad is incredibly knowledgeable with bikes, cars, etc... but this is my first project, and I want to continue to learn all that I can about my bike.

Thanks!

 

Nice start

 

the old man only had 3000 miles on him?
you may be able to get the rear tail section and make the bike stock again. it is a 1 year model only.
member hogfiddles was parting one out maybe he could help you out

lose the pods and get the airbox if you can find one.

do a compressin test on motor first. check the valve clearances
if comp test is bad you could have a stuck ring east to fix with acetone and atf mixture

 

I do have the frame... and the airbox.... and the wiring harness-----

 

Xj550h, I’m almost certain that the original mileage is correct. I was very happily surprised to see it on the title, and the odometer. Also we have been trying to find an airbox. I’ve read that they provide a more sufficient amount of filtering, and the pods are garbage anyway. It looks like hogfiddles has one of those as well! Thank you for the advice concerning compression. I’ve been told that once we connect the harness to all of the ignition components, and get it to turn over, we’ll be able to do that. I have read about the 650 seca history before. I do know it is a one year bike, however, I will be going the custom build route, and making it a brat style bike.

Thanks!

 

Hogfiddles, I purchased a wiring harness, but I’ve been looking around for the airbox with no luck! Would you mind if I saw pictures of it?

Thanks!!

 

Will do.... won't be home for several hours though----

 

Thank you!!

 

That’s alright! I’ll watch for a notification!

Thank you!

 

01/04/18
I’ve gone through the bike and attached most of the electronics/ignition/starter parts to the factory harness. We took the previous coils off (which turned out to be automotive coils), and attached stock coils that we found through grim cycle salvage (Orem, UT). I also cleaned the carbs. I also emptied the oil, and took a look at the filter and spark plugs. All of these components were brand new, and I didn’t know until after I emptied the oil, but it was a nice surprise.

DAMAGE: we found cracks on all four intake carburetor boot joints. We also found that the gas tank leaks, due to a drop by the previous owner. If anyone knows where I can find a solid gas tank, let me know!

I will be making final adjustments to the bike in order to find out if it starts or not within the next couple of days!

 

Update on gas tank damage: looks like a repair was previously attempted, and done wrong. Does anyone have suggestions?

Thanks!!

 

My suggestion is to remove all of the bondo, and have the holes brazed shut properly.
It'll need body filler to get the tank's shape back, but that tank looks sound enough to use. Finding a better one might require buying an already restored 650 Seca.

 

XJ650SECATAY,
Frequently, the "Cracks" in old Yamaha intake boots do not extend to the inside or cause any leaks. Most have a metal core (not sure of our XJ650's). Yes, they look like "poo" but are normally completely functional and cause no performance issues.

The area where the clamp to the carbs sits in that groove is quite thin and the forward edge of that clamp area is the area which needs a thorough inspection. Personally, I've bent these areas open, pushed in a little black RTV and used these ugly (but fully functional) boots for a good while until I was able to purchase replacements. Replacements tend to be a bit "Pricey" and you've got plenty of other things on the agenda that are likely a higher priority.

Just my 2-cents.
Kurt

 

Uh-oh.....looks like measles---

 

+1
Back when replacements were unobtanium the boots got thoroughly cleaned and degreased. Then the black oilresistant RTV was massaged ino the cracks (wear gloves). Finally a skim coat was applied all around the outside of the boots, and smoothed with a wet (gloved) finger.

 

Thank you for all of your suggestions. I will be trying to make the intake boots last as long as possible (due to the price of new boots), and I will be searching for someone who can repair my gas tank fully.

01/05/17
Today while we were preparing to start the bike, we took another look at the wiring diagram, and noticed some irregularities (due to confusion on our part). We found that we were missing a diode box, and the starter solenoid. I have been eager to get this bike started, but delays in progress are a natural part of any project. I was able to find both the starter solenoid, and the diode box (previously used on a 1982 xs750 virago, I believe) on ebay from Ride Powersports in west valley:
http://stores.ebay.com/Ride-Powersports

Tomorrow, I will be making final adjustments before we try to start the bike. some of these include: double checking harness connections, checking safety switches (side stand, neutral, clutch), attaching the choke cable, and supplying the fuse box with power, via the harness/positive battery terminal.

Due to the gas tank damage, we will be using a gravity feed drip system that auto mechanics use while doing fuel injection cleanings, to supply gasoline to the carburetors. I hope to have it started by tomorrow!!

(I thought that I should include website URL's/company info whenever I am able to find a part that I need. Here is the URL for Grim Cycle Salvage: http://www.grimcyclesalvage.com ... Shaun, The owner, is INCREDIBLY helpful and knowledgeable, and I have heard that his wife runs their website and ebay store.. I would absolutely recommend taking a look on their website, and if you can't find what your looking for, give them a call!)

Thanks

 

We just go to Len Chacal at xj4ever, right at the top of each page.

 

That's very helpful, thank you!

 

01/06/18
We connected everything that was left, and noticed (via the wiring diagram) that we also needed to connect the oil level and neutral switch switches. On the diagram, the oil level switch is supposed to be a B/R (black/red) wire, and the neutral switch is supposed to be a Sb (sky blue) wire. These colors are correct on the harness, however, we found a white wire connected t the oil level switch and a B/R wire tied into the sub harness that seems to be connected to the neutral switch, with a blue wire next to it (the blue wire was not connected to anything). So we put color to the side, connected the blue wire to the oil level switch and plugged into the B/R on the harness, and the B/R neutral switch wire to the Sb wire used for the neutral switch on the harness (sorry for all of the colors, i imagine that will get confusing).

Watching for smoke, we hooked a jumper battery up to the positive and negative ends of the solenoid, turned the key, and pressed the start button. Nothing happened, except the oil level instrument light came on when I held the start button. I imagine that finding out what is prohibiting the starter from turning over will be a long and tedious process, however, I am open to any helpful suggestions or ideas.

The bike will be stored for now, as I am attending college, so I probably won't have any updates on it for a while!

Thanks!

 

Did you have the clutch lever pulled in?
Or
Were you in neutral?
Or
Was your kickstand down?

 

Yes, I had the clutch pulled in, i was in neutral. however, the bike does not have a side stand relay or side stand switch. we just jumped the sidestand switch.

 

if you pulled or do not have the side stand relay (be cirtain) you do not have to worry about the side stand switch.
oil light is supposed to come on when starter button is pushed to test the light bulb

jump across the solinoid to see if starter works. when you turn on the key do you hear a click (starter cutoff relay)
if your oil light comes on it could just be your solinoid is bad

 

I know we don't have the side stand relay, so we just jumped the switch entirely. We will have to try jumping the solenoid as well! however, we did not hear a click when we turned the key.

 

the bike will run without the sidestand relay remove the jumper wire

The Ultimate Relay, Switch, Sensor, and Diodes Guide

Sidestand (kickstand) switch:
- twist the two (or three, depending on the model) wires together and ground them. Grounding the wires is the only way to complete the circuit that activates the sidestand switch relay.

Sidestand (kickstand) relay:
- unplug the safety relay which disables the whole bloody mess but DO NOT leave it that way, fix it right!

XJ650RJ Seca and XJ750 Euro models:

NOTE: according to the factory XJ650RJ Seca service manual supplement, both the headlight relay and the sidestand relay are under the tank---this is wrong!

It also shows that the ignition cut-off relay is below the TCI?---this is also wrong!

Flasher: near the steering headpipe, on right side frame rail, under the right side ignition coil.
Flasher canceller: under the rear of gas tank.
Starter motor solenoid/relay: on right hand side, attached to and behind the battery box.
Starter/Ignition cut-off relay (no color): on 650RJ and 650 Euro models, located behind self-canceller, under rear of tank (note: the drawing and the description in the service manual is wrong).
Sidestand (kickstand) relay (blue): behind the flasher relay, under the front of the tank.
Headlight relay (yellow): behind the left frame side cover, on the plastic regulator-rectifier mounting plate. (note: the drawing and the description in the service manual is wrong).
Diode block: inside the headlight housing.
Neutral switch: in a hole in the bottom of the crankcase, just "outside" of the oil pan, on the bottom of the engine, up inside a recessed "well".

 

The ignition/ starter cutoff realay is located under the rear of the fuel tank on the left, and has no color dot on the relay side of the connector. If it is not clicking when the key is turned on, then you either aren't getting power to the relay, or the realy is faulty (or you've misidentified it as being the sidestand relay)
If you're going by the service manual for relay locations, it has several errors. Use this guide instead
the-ultimate-relay-switch-sensor-and-diodes-guide.27543

 

03/22/18
I jumped the solenoid today. She cranked over; however, I am not getting any spark.
I found a how-to video on youtube that included some very helpful tips on diagnosing this problem.
I purchased a multimeter to start tracing where the problem could be coming from, but I am fairly new to this, so if anyone has suggestions, I am all ears!
Thanks!

 

03/24/18
I did a number of electrical tests. I back tracked all the way from the ignition coils to the pickup coils using the multimeter and a 12v circuit tester. the ignition coils and pickup coils all tested with good resistance; however, I was not able to pick up on any connection using the circuit tester. I tested the circuits while jumping the solenoid and holding the clutch lever in. I'm sure there are a lot of connections being interrupted because of the used harness, but with my low skill set, trying to diagnose electrical problems is not an easy task. I don't have a sidestand relay, so I'm going to start there, but I am open to all other suggestions!
Thanks!

 

Do you want/need a sidestand relay? I’m pretty sure I still have mine off of my Seca. As well as a few other electrical parts if needed

 

not having a sidestand relay is not a problem , when you remove the sidestand relay it bypasses the sidestand switch

 

lets take a walk through.
with key on
start at ignition fuse 12 volts at fuse output?
then the red/white wire runs to the run/kill switch 12 volts at the connector for the run switch and 12 volts on and off at the connector for the switch?
recap constant 12 volts on 1 red/white wire ,switchable 12 volts at other red/white wire with run switch ,12 volts in run position nothing in off position.
switchable red/white wire then runs to oil light and to starter cutoff safety relay .
do you have 12 volts at the starter cutoff relay in and out ?
do you have 12 volts at the TCI red white connection and both ignition coils red/white ? this is all from the input side wire to starter cutoff relay.

do you have 12 volts at the solinoid red/white wire? this is from output side of starter cut off relay.
do you have 12 volts at the blue/white wire running from solenoid to starter switch ?
it will be less than the red/white wire in the same connector
.this is also where the oil light comes back to connect to the blue white wire.
it goes to diode block as a B/R wire then out of diode as L/w Blue/white to solinoid.

so when you press the starter button what happens? does oil light come on and starter spin or solinoid click?


MOST important is that your battery be fully charged because if it drops below 10 volts while starter is cranking you do not get spark.

that is the entire run of the ignition fuse

there are a few more tests
do you get 12 volts at the starter button blue/white wire?
by any chance are your handle bars painted ? the handle bars are the ground for starter switch.
if still chrome check control body make sure where it clamps to handlebar is clean.

 

I will get back to you on that one! It looks like I wont need it to start my bike, but I will keep it in mind, thank you!

 

03/28/18
I was able to start some of these tests yesterday! Surprisingly, once I tested the ignition fuse, I noticed that I was only getting around 10.5-10.8 volts from my jumper box. I decided to use my car battery to try it out. I was able to get a lot more volts through the system.

I have a new problem now: I was trying to put gas into the carbs, and the fuel line kind of just overflowed lie it was blocked. I took the line off to check and it wasn't blocked. I took the carbs off of the bike to manually put gas into the bowls ( I found no gas in any of the bowls when I took them off, but gas leaked out of the float hinges, so I am lost there). I tried starting it again and got the same result. Then I tried starter fluid, and it almost fired up, but the carbs aren't allowing any fuel through so it wont start all the way. I took the carbs apart a little bit to check the fuel rail that supplies all of the carbs with gas, and found that it wasn't clogged up or anything.

I only checked one spark plug (#4) to verify if there was spark or not. This spark was small and white, so I am going to check the other three plugs to see if they have a stronger spark.

 

How thoroughly? Did you replace any of the parts? What did your float needles look like?

 

I also forgot to mention that I was able to get spark with the battery, but it was small and white.

When I bought the bike, the first thing I did was thoroughly clean the carbs. All of the pieces are clean and, float needles are great too, so I'm not exactly sure why gas isn't getting to the bowls.

However; I was actually able to check the rest of the spark plugs just barely and all of their sparks are weak.

 

04/22/18



We stripped the paint, and welded the holes in the gas tank, I bought a fuel filter and hooked everything up. the results can be heard in the video. I'm not sure if the carbs are filling with gas or delivering the fuel to the cylinders. I have tried jumping the solenoid while pressing the start button and holding the clutch in, but still no start. that's the only guess I have. Please, if anyone has any suggestions, I would love to hear them!

 

Your carbs have you done a full year down ?( church of clean) recommended . But if you just want it to start try a "hot shot" drain float bowls , pull fuel line get a large meat injector syringe fill fuel line with Berrymans B12 carb cleaner (autozone) and a little acetone let sit for 30 minutes . Drain bowls , reconnect fuel line and refill by putting on PRI and see if it starts . Cheers

 

Thanks man. we tried it out, recleaned the carbs, and it runs now

 

UPDATE:

I was able to get the bike running (a video of it running is posted in another thread of mine). It is running rich, but I'll figure that out later when I decide what air cleaning system I want to use with my carbs (pods, stock air box) and when I have the carbs jetted. I am rebuilding the front brake calipers, adding stainless braided brake lines, and I picked up a set of all four brake pads and a rear brake shoe on ebay for $28.00!

Next problem to address... I don't remember if I have brought this up before, but there were small holes left in the tank from someone attempting to pull a dent out. They filled it with bondo or something and gas started leaking as soon as I filled it up. I found this maybe a day after I bought it. Anyway, a friend of mine helped me strip the paint to look for more holes, and he was able to tig weld the holes. this took care of the biggest holes, but because of the thin metal, gas still continued to leak through small pinholes in the welds. there were at least four that I knew of so I did some research. I wanted to just solder the pinholes, but there were probably a lot more that I didn't know about. then I found out about "Red-Kote." It's a fuel tank liner that seals pinholes in the gas tank and prevents further rusting. I am waiting to do another coat of red-kote in my gas tank, as I want to be very thorough with it, but I will update you guys with how it turns out and probably make another thread about it with pictures and he process that I used to prepare my tank to be coated.

I found that the gaskets in my petcock were all cracked and desperately needed a rebuild as well. I was able to find a petcock rebuild kit for around $13.00 on ebay.

I'll update you on anything else that comes up!


BRAKE PADS/SHOE: $28.00
https://www.ebay.com/itm/FRONT-BRAK...l:Seca&hash=item419b36f01c:g:tN8AAOSwjVVV04Zx


RED-KOTE 1 qt.: $25.00
https://www.ebay.com/itm/RED-KOTE-G...271078&hash=item3fa43c1ab5:g:~pkAAOSwEK9UDcTd


PETCOCK REBUILD: $13.00
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Outlaw-Rac...929599&hash=item2a53cb567a:g:w7UAAOSwE-xbDaTV

 

Careful of eBay stuff... especially where it comes to fuel management and stopping! Cheaps parts are JUST That! That is not a full rebuild kit that you're getting there. Also make sure you buff the heck out of the seating surfaces inside the petcock and slather the rubbers with a touch of silicone grease... not vaseline! Also you might want to replace the onboard fuel filter (kinda looks like an upside down bic lighter) while you're in there...

 

Deinitely! good to know. I took a look inside the petcock and only found those four pieces. But along with the on board filter, what else do I need to rebuild he petcock? thanks!

 

Uh-oh. Hope you at least got 2 shoes. That way you might eventually stop.

At least you should be able to turn the oetcock to PRI when it doesn't work otherwise....

 

The components that appear in the picture of the listing you shared are a good start. Please keep in mind that there is a good chance that the quality could be crap. I recommend buying the full rebuild kit from Len (top right of every page). Yes it will be more expensive... but.... buy it, get the quality components to get the job done right... Do the rebuild and you won't regret it. And don't forget... Len is there for you if you have any questions regarding the items you have purchased from him.

At minimum, a petcock rebuild for the 650RJ should have the pieces that are pictured... PLUS....

- "Bic Lighter" filter as previously discussed
- Oval gasket that goes between the petcock and the tank... and none of this "circle o-ring" stuff... this is a special o-ring that is shaped exactly like the groove that is in the base of your petcock.
- Washer Gaskets (not sure what else to call them... they are black and "squishy-ish") that are used for the mounting screws that hold the petcock to the tank
- New wave washer that provides pressure to the lever
- New diaphragm block (the RJ's kit come with a nifty new one! Though you can use the old one... I saved mine!)
-New diaphragm spring (doesn't come with the kit [extra purchase] but potentially worth the investment)

Lens kit also comes with new mounting screws for both the petcock itself and the faceplate.

Also get yourself a container of silicone grease (yes, Len has it) to lube everything. Again, No Vaseline... you need a non petroleum based lubricant.

Just rebuilt my RJ's petcock with a kit from Len a few weekends ago. Guess what... Works great.

 

Stay away from Red Kote. Despite claims of reformulation, its still not a great liner. It will peel eventually.
Caswell's is much better, and the only problems I've ever had or heard about were due to improper preperation.

caswell-epoxy-gas-tank-sealer-motorcycle-kit-up-to-10-gal-cans.html