Orange n Black's 700

Well since the carbs were the wrong ones and pieces of crap I decided to buy the 2 34mm smooth bore carb setup from CycleX. The two into one intakes wouldn't fit the XJ, so I have to make some. I can get some soft grade steel pipe from work for nothing, thought about using copper but some have said that ethanol corrodes the copper (although people have used copper tubing to make ethanol for many years.....120 proof) :lol: , I also heard that cpvc pipe could be used.

So what are your thoughts? Give me your 2 cents.

 

Orange and Black,
First time I have seen this build, And I gotta say it looks Grrrrrrrreat! (Sorry had to do it) seriously it looks good, but as another guys said, when can we hope to see the whole bike in one pic?

 

I would try a PVC intake. I believe it should hold up just fine.

Something like the picture I attached. You can also play with the length of the intake before the carb of after the carb to change where your power is.

 

Thanks camelman, originally I was going for black fast flames but everyone says Tony the Tiger. At least nobody said Tigger. :lol: Pics will come as soon as I get the carbs straightened out.

Gennro, your pic is exactly what I'm going for. The cpvc is better because its able to handle heat and pressure, just didn't know if the fuel would eat thru it or not.

 

When I mentioned (intake) I was talking about from head to carbs for those that didn't understand.

 

WHO-WHO-A-WHOOOOO

DOES THIS 2 CARB SETUP WORK WELL? Who has tried this and made it worked? has anybody done it with one Carb?

 

Don't know about the one carb set up but if you want to look see at what I got go to: www.cyclexchange.net/Twin Carb Systems Index Pg..htm

Seems to work for these guys and they sale frames too.

 

http://www.cyclexchange.net/Yamaha%20Carb%20Page.htm

These ones?

 

That's the ones.

 

Well I know its been a while, but I made some headway with the intakes. The 2 90 degree elbows back 2 back were the right length to fit the intake boots.

 

After gluing these together, I made a notch (dead top center) and drilled a hole with a fostner bit and attached a straight piece that I trimmed to allow maximum flow.

 

Next I attached the carbs to 45 degree elbows that crammed into some intake boots that came with the carb setup. This was done to keep the filters from hitting the frame. Although this setup looked cool, my leg would knock the filter off when I put my leg down when coming to a stop. So I'm going to shorten the straight pieces and replace the 45 degree elbows with straight couplings. That will direct the filters under the seat which will keep the water out but decrease the cool factor(at least it will run right). :wink:

 

...less carbs?
Are people talking about less carbs?

I have enough experience on the XS11 to know that value. 2 would be good, but I wonder if a single would be possible...
In theory it is, but fitting it under the frame is another story. Of course, if you could bring intake PVC pipes down a bit and back towards the stock airbox, a large single carb might fit, but air filter is another story.

My mind is buzzing. Maybe this train of thought can keep me not bored at work tonight. Anyone know the size difference? Is it as simple as half the carbs=twice the size?

 

Orange through some gas in there and fire that mother up!!!!! Can you do some video?

 

Ok guys, less carbs? Answer yes, because not all the cylinders fire at the same time it will work with 2 instead of 4. 1 carb will work if its big enough and all the intake pipes have equal flow (not an easy task). Hopefully next week I'll have it running and make a video if I can figure out how to post it that is. :roll:

BTW BlkMage this kit was made for the XS by CycleX. They also make kits for 750 4 Hondas that use the same carbs. These are 34mm carbs while the original carbs for my bike were 33mm. Since the carb is slightly larger it should handle 2 cylinders that aren't firing at the same time.

 

Pretty cool man! When it's all finished find a shop to make you a manifold!

 

Thought about making some out of brass, I think that would look great. After I work out any problems with the cpvc I'll look into finding the right parts, maybe a plumbing supply company will have something that will work.

 

I want to see this run.

 

Not as bad as I do!

 

Lookin good

 

Thanks Plumber. I tucked the carbs back in under the tank and made up the fuel lines. On another note, I came up with a solution with what to do with all the wires that used to be under the speedo and tach along with the wires from the head light bucket. I stuffed them in a double electrical box that I had lying around and mounted it between the triple trees. Here's another pic before I moved the carbs and a pic of the box.

 

I'll have to seal up all the holes in that box and I have a new head light on the way. Then I'll have to come up with a way to mount the indicator lights, I'll be replacing the originals with the 1/4 inch round type.

 

It shouldn't be to hard to find a shop to make a manifold for you. A welding shop or some thing.

 

If I had the money I'd find a nice machine shop which is why I'm making my own.
Hooked up the fuel lines and cranked her up today, she ran all of 10 seconds. Seems that I have too much restriction, may have to go with a 2 petcock system. It would be great if I had a Virago tank lying around. :roll:

 

1 gas line should feed those 2 carbs..

youcould get these intakes made from loonynum for 200 or less i would assume

 

that gas/air mix is gonna destroy that PVC in short order. time to contact choppersprocket@yahoo.com

 

That's what I thought as well,but on the CycleX website all the bike pics show two separate lines and petcocks.

 

DW, why do you think the pvc will be destroyed?

 

gasoline eats plastic, and im sure it wont like back fires either

 

I used cpvc (hot water pipe) because it withstands pressure and heat. I assumed that pvc would be ok since manufacturers are making pvc fuel lines.

 

Orange just curious what size jets are in your new carbs

 

pilot-15, needle jet 159-p-6, needle-6f9, throttle slide-2.0, main jet-180
Also came with extra pilot-20 and main-190.
What's your opinion on the cpvc intakes?

 

Do a test place a small piece of cpvc in gasoline and see if it degrades. If it does not then you should be ok.

 

I dont have a clue about the cpvc material but I bet if you called the manufacturer and spoke with an engineer they could help you out you would be surprised how helpful some of them can be they love to talk about new applications for their products. I ll tell you why I asked, Seems to me the carb set you have now is setup to feed a cylinder thats 325cc and the engine is only asking for half that amount because the cylinders are 180 degrees apart. Think of it this way only one cylinder draws on the carb at a time.

 

i Have seen several bikes with pvc intakes i think if it does eat it it will take a long time. I would be more worried about it eating the pvc glue and causing vac leaks. All you can do is try if it does start to eat thru you will have a great mock up to make a metal one

 

Thanks guys for your responses. I looked on google for more info on the cpvc, all I could find out is that it is resistant to chemical corrosion and contamination and it is made of resins of a petroleum base. I think cutlass was right about the glue being more of a concern.
Waldo, this same system is used on 750's with success, so I'm sure it will work on my 700 with some adjustments and maybe some jet changes. Keep in mind that originally there was a 33mm carb for each cylinder. That would be 1 33mm carb per 175cc's. But like you said, some 32mm carbs might be enough.
I know there is a restriction problem now because if let the bike sit with petcock open for 5 minutes, it will crank and run for about 10 seconds (burning up the fuel in the bowls) then die. 5 minutes later, same thing.

 

run bigger diameter fuel line, I had to with my CR125 carb too.

 

My petcock doesn't shutoff so I had to put a inline shutoff after the petcock. It's 1/4 inch which is all I could find, from there the line goes to a inline filter which is also 1/4 inch, then to a 3 way splitter which is 5/16 inch, to the carbs.

I removed the inline filter and ran 5/16 line to the splitter, then to the carbs whith same results. This is why I was considering running 2 separate petcocks and lines. Here's a pic from the CycleX site of their setup.

 

Update: I converted the vent line on the back side of the petcock into a second fuel line. Now I have to get new gaskets for the petcock to re-assemble.
My son-in-law knocked over the fuel tank messing up the paint, now I have to repaint. :evil:

 

Re-assembling the petcock tomorrow and installing. Then I'll crank this thing up and go from there.
Purchased this headlight and waiting on the shipment.

 

Update:
1. Headlight installed and working.
2.Carbs, petcock, filters, shutoff valves and lines are installed.
3.Cranked up and runs well at idle.

Will take for a ride sometime this week for final adjustments.
Then I'll make a video if I can figure out how to upload.
It is a happy day. 8)

 

Throttle response is smooth, low and medium rpm range operates very well with acceleration to spare. All cylinders are working well,but on the rich side. No backfiring, but will have to put on mufflers because its too freaking loud. How loud? Small children run screaming when I drive down the street, went around the neighborhood and the wife thought I was still in the driveway from the noise.
Came home from work to find the petcock leaking yet again, so I'll have to fix this once and for all before testing high rpm operation. With going back to mufflers, I may have to re-jet since its already running rich. Only time will tell about the cpvc intakes and glue, will update. Here's a couple of pics for those pic crazed people on the site. :lol:

 

Hi Orange N Black Just read your rebuild post and I found it to be very
interesting. You have done a good job with an interesting carb mod as well. Going for two carbs meant for a 650 twin
was a good move and when you have them jetted up properly I think
that it will run really well. You may still have to have them synched with
a set of gauges or something so they are both pulling together properly. It makes a really big difference. Your build is really interesting and I am looking forward to the next post.

I dont think that fuel attacks the type of plastic that you are using for
your intake tubes but as people are saying the glue may come unstuck. Soaking some in fuel should reveal what will happen.

Bob

 

Thanks Bobe, the big problem I'm having now is with the petcock. I'm going to replace the petcock with a high flow aftermarket type as soon as I can. Of coarse this means more modifications. :roll:

 

This is the hard part of modifications. You do something only to find that you have to do something else to support the first thing that
you did and around it goes. Great post and catch u later.

Bob

 

Slight manifold problem.
As you know I have 1 carb feeding cyls. 1&2 and 1 carb feeding cyls. 3&4. Although the all the manifold pieces are of equal length, most of the fuel/air mixture seems to be moving towards the center of the head. For example, spark plug results for carb 1(cylinders 1 & 2) are, cylinder 1 is whitish while cylinder 2 is sooty. Plug results for carb 2(cylinders 3 & 4) are, cylinder 3 is sooty while cylinder 4 is tan.
I believe that I'm going to place a plenium inside each manifold to divert a larger percentage of fuel/air mix to the outside cylinders. Whats your opinions on this?

 

I've also seen balancing "plenums" between carb banks to equalize the vacuum (similar to YICS but larger). I think it will be more of a chore to get the 2 balancing "flaps" just right than to go back to 4 carbs. Are the inner/outer plastic tubes the same temperature? I would think plastic would be less affected by temperature, but maybe there is an issue with vaporization. Maybe if the 1/2 and 3/4 manifolds were longer (more like "sanitary Y's") it might flow better, but then the carbs would be further back...

 

I agree that a (Y) shape would be better. Maybe its time to break out the brass pipe, cut 2 pieces with a 45 degree elbow into a single stem?

 

Orange have you thought about running different heat range spark plugs in the 2 center cylinders say go one range hotter

 

I've also seen some parallel twins with a single carb and soldered copper manifolds. Don't know if the selection of copper Y connectors is any better than PVC but might be worth a look.