Start button just clicks

I think I figured out when 2 are the red wires just from the wiring diagram -- I connected those together and that's what blew a fuse. Does this run through the fuse box from relay?

Yes I have the haynes manual.

 

blew the fuse from connecting them or pressing the starter button?
fuse runs to the starter switch then to the relay, from relay to solenoid.
the other side of the solenoid coil is blue and runs to the kill switch in run position to ground.
blue wire also goes to diode block

so if the fuse blows on connecting the wires together i would suspect the the diode block may have failed.
if fuse blows when you press starter button i would suspect solenoid coil is shorted

 

When I press the start button - but I think only with the relay bypassed

 

Do you have the correct relay and location. Per the print, you should have R/W, R/W, Sb, and B/Y. Per Lens ultimate relay guide your relay is located under the gas tank, and not under the regulator as noted on the starter troubleshooting guide.

"on all XJ650 Maxim/Midnight Maxim/RJ Seca models: under the gas tank, in-between the frame tubes, on a welded bracket just behind the flasher self-canceller relay."

Do a sanity check on your meter, test a known good source such as your car battery or other know voltage source to eliminate test equipment or operator error.

So either your battery is toast and dropping out or the starter / wiring is bad - exactly as stu noted on the first reply.

 

I thought it was under the tank for UK model and under the side cover for USA? that's what the manual says and this
http://xj650.blogspot.com/2009/03/how-to-test-your-starter-circuit.html

I tested the meter it's good.

when shorting across the solenoids doesn't this just pass voltage down to the relay?

 

yes shorting across the bolts sends voltage to the starter

 

http://www.xjbikes.com/forums/threads/the-ultimate-relay-switch-sensor-and-diodes-guide.27543/

Note the reference to the service manual is wrong.

XJ650 Maxim and Midnight Maxim models:

Flasher: near the steering headpipe, on right side frame rail, under the right side ignition coil.
Flasher canceller: under the rear of gas tank, behind ignition coils
Starter motor solenoid/relay: on right hand side, attached to and behind the battery box.
Diode block: inside the headlight housing.
Starter/Ignition cut-off relay (no color): behind the turn signal self-canceller. (note: the drawing and the description in the service manual is wrong).
1980-81 Sidestand (kickstand) relay (blue): did not use.
1982-84 Sidestand (kickstand) relay (blue): frame bracket outbound of LH frame tube, just behind the left ignition coil.
Headlight relay (yellow): behind the left frame side cover, on the plastic regulator-rectifier mounting plate. (note: the drawing and the description in the service manual is wrong).
Neutral switch: in a hole in the bottom of the crankcase, just "outside" of the oil pan, on the bottom of the engine, up inside a recessed "well".

Not to a relay, shorting across the two large nuts on the solenoid applies high current battery voltage directly to the starter bypassing all safety circuits. Therefore, if the motor does not turn over when doing this the battery, starter, or wiring is defective. No sparks when shorting (and battery voltage at the cables stays above 10V or so), then there is an open in the wiring or the starter, most likely the starter brushes to commutator. Brush to commutator issues can sometimes be momentarily corrected by gently tapping on the starter housing with a plastic hammer.

So what about the 30 volts mentioned earlier, is that still happening? Bike is not running when measuring?

 

you have stated the bike starts with the bump start.did you bypass the clutch safety switch if not i would do that at this time. I think you have implied it is not working correctly.
varify the relay you are working on. sounds like it may be the wrong one.

solenoid does click when you press the button correct?
if so disconnect the wire that goes to the starter hook your meter (volt test) to that bolt and see if you get voltage to that bolt when you press the starter button if not it is the output side of the soleinoid.
check continuity from the wire you disconnected to the starter bolt it is hooked to.
see if you have voltage to the small wires on the solenoid 1 side should be 12 volts the blue wire should be less than the measured voltage. if you have voltage to both wires solenoid may be good at that part of it.
you could also use a jumper wire from ground and touch it to the blue wire (lower voltage side) of the solenoid that should complete ground . if that makes your starter turn I would look at the relay.

also as suggested you may want to test your battery for voltage drop when you try to start it.
the solenoid is just a big relay coil and contacts.

 

So after I now know the correct relay which was very confusing -- I can confirm that is bypassed buy connecting the two red/white wires together.. The solenoid clicks when I push start -- when I disconnect the two red/white wires it doesn't so I know that is good. Now i have voltage to the other side of the solenoid (other side to battery) when I press the start button. So the problem is between that side of the solenoid and the starter... is there anything between those things?

 

when you press the starter button if you have no voltage at the output of solenoid connection to starter, where the starter cable connects, it is your solenoid and needs to be replaced.

from solenoid to starter is just the cable check and clean connections, and for voltage at starter connection. if you have voltage there its time to look at the starter.

starter rebuild instructions are in the diy forum

 

you also want to comfirm running voltage of the charging system to address possible 30 volt measurement you spoke of.
the analog meter you are using may swing high then settle at the actual voltage.

 

Starter motor is broken, check the brushes

 

Looks like i've found the problem --





So I guess I have 2 questions:

1) What can I do - do I need to replace the whole thing or can I find parts to fix it.
2) Why did the wiring burn out - could it be that I am getting high voltage from the battery that overloaded the starter burning out the wring?

I haven't been able to start it so I can't tell y'all the running voltage on the battery. It should start from a bump right with the starter motor removed?

 

It should start from a bump, but you're gonna blow oil everywhere.....

 

So my other big question is --- is it safe to ride? Can I just tape off the "hole" where the starter motor connects into - is that engine oil that lubes those parts?

I can put the motor back on if this is required for now while figure out what to do with it.

Anyone got any parts they don't need?

 

Pic #1 - was the square notched part of the plate installed on the square peg of the case?

Gary H.

 

I believe so - why? I was working... then clearly something happened that fried the wring

 

In another thread a PO had incorrectly installed new brushes and the plate must be correctly installed.

Gary H.

 

So do you guys think this would work to fix it....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Starter-KIT...ash=item415f1fadc9:g:PkEAAMXQstJTmIxM&vxp=mtr

 

good price if its just the brush setup that has failed it should do the job fine.
just when your done bump start it first to check your voltage.