Carb cleaning adventure/questions thread!

I prefer the high country vs the beach......I dont ride out here on the interstates unless I am headed to the hills or to the beach...just too crazy......young punks & their Hondas zipping in & out....well.....just too much traffic......if one goes down...you have about 5 or 6 cars putting tire marks on your back.....

With regards to Colorado, i was there in the early eighties 81 thru 85.....loved it in Western Colorado....

 

Five- I couldn't imagine riding on those freeways out there either! It truly is insane, and that motorcycle law is nuts, where people can feel free to ride in between cars!!

So I'm ordering new float needles/seats, gaskets, and new drain screws from Len tomorrow. I'll spend the next 2 days figuring out how to get these drain screws out. If I can get just one out, then I'll be OK, I'll just have to swap bowls. Hopefully I can get em all out. Once the new gaskets and float valves are in, I'll attempt to do a wet set, then a bench sync.

My question is, those pilot screws I took out to look at (which were VERY clean already and came out without any issues) are now all backed out 2 1/2 turns each. they were originally all different. One was 5 turns in, the other 6 turns, the other a couple, and the last 3 turns. What exactly do these screws do?

I'll need to ride on a bench sync for a while till I can either borrow or secure the funds to get a YICS stick and carb sticks. I'll also need to save for a carbtune. I just found out my helmet expired, so those tools will take me quite some time to save for. Can I run on a bench sync OK?

 

Lane splitting is actually allowed in much of the world outside of US. Some people think it's actually safer.

Good plan. Heat always works for me.

They adjust mixture by controlling the amount of gas getting in.

You can try to plug YICS with some oily rags. I don't know how well that works, but people here say they did it.

I made my own manometer: http://xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic/t=42895.html

 

short answer, they control the a/f ratio (mixture) at small throttle openings.
long answer, their magic, Rick can explain it better than i.
why were they set different ? manufacturing tolerances
you can ride on a bench sync, not the finest tune but it'll work.
some people (me) don't use a yics tool but we won't go into that here.
you can make a carb balancing tool for a few bucks and get the same results as a store bought one.

 

Interesting build, I'll see if I can pull that off. I still don't know exactly how to even use one of those things. Polock, thanks man. The caps were off so someone before me messed with those screws. Bench sync is the paper clip method correct? The butterflies were really in sync actually, just eyeballing it though, I'll get in there and get it as close as I can.. The carbs were shockingly clean, hopefully its just a float valve problem (gas in crankcase) because other than that, I see no issue with these carbs. Even the enrichment circuit in the float bowls was absolutely spotless. 10 feet shot of carb cleaner on all 4 bowls... man I just want to ride! Hopefully I can get this puppy back on the road by next weekend. Counting on Len's fast shipping

 

Don't battle with Sync Screws that might not have moved in their lifetime.
Prep them for Fine-tuning.
Pull them. Replace corroded or Striped ones.
If they're OK, ... Wire Wheel them pristine.
Lube. Replace.
Get them ready for Tweaking.

Bench Sync with the Throttle Plate of No.-3 effectively closed.
[ 3X5 Card, Business Card, Resume' Paper or Envelope, 35mm Negative Strips ]

Preset:
Dealership Implemented Setting:
Between 2.75 + 3.00 cheated closer to 3.00 Turns Out.
ColorTune if possible.

Assure that the Pilot System WILL keep the Bike Idling on-its-own.
Tweaked, so that it won't stall unless it runs out of gas.
Adjustments to Pilot Mixture Screws are made with great precision.
Disregard the "Quarter-turn" gradients.
Tweak = ( +/- ) Width of a Nickel.
The "Sweet-Jesus I-got-it" spot can come and go in a quarter-turn.

Your Mission:
Get a steady Idle without hearing "The Poppity's".
Once you find where the Bike will Idle you will be in the Ball Park.
A ColorTune Plug will put you right-in the Ball Park, ... quick.

After she Idle's like a Sewing Machine, ...
Add what the Plant --> needs <-- to keep you from having to goose-it (Throttle-blipping) to get-out-of-the-hole.

Don't make 2 adjustments at a time.
You won't know what you did that changes the tuning.

Take two aspirins.
Buy a Genuine Yamaha Factory Workshop Manual.
Say Goodnight Gracie.

 

Rick, you're talking about the little pilot screws right? The ones right next to the plunger?

Or are you talking about the screws that sync the butterflies together? It sounds like you're talking about both! Gah I feel so dumb, and yes I've read and re-read the haynes manual many times on this!

Thanks for all your help by the way

 

He's talking about both.

Mixture tweaking (the pilot screws X4) comes AFTER sync.

There are three sync screws. The #3 carb has no sync screw, it is "home base" and adjusted via the main knob.

The way it works is this (especially if you have a two-bottle or tube loop type "comparative" manometer)

Carb #1 is "slaved" off #2; adjust #2 and it takes #1 with it.

SO: You sync #1 to #2. Then you sync #2 to #3; it brings #1 with it. If using a two-holer rig, you can go back and compare #1 to #3, but #2 is the key. Then you sync #4 to #3.

During the process if the idle gets too low or too high, you adjust with the main knob (which adjusts all 4.)

YICS should be blocked for this process; yes you can sync without blocking YICS but doing it that way can "mask" a slightly out of sync condition.

THEN after all is sync'ed and done, then and only then do you start fiddling with the pilot mixture screws.

 

Awesome, thank you Fitz. I'll be running a bench sync for the time being actually so I just won't mess with the pilot screws till I can come up with the money for a carb sync tool.

Much appreciated guys. Taking torch to float bowl tomorrow in anticipation of receiving my order from Len. So nothing on the gaskets that I'm getting in? Just scrape off old gasket and place new gasket on carb body, connect float bowls and I'm done? No RTV or anything like that?

 

No gasket sealer. Lightly grease them so they won't stick and can be re-used. LIGHTLY.

Here we go with "the money for a carb sync tool" thing again.

All you need to make a comparative (2-"hole") manometer is a 7 or 8 foot hunk of clear vinyl tubing, a yardstick, and a few CC's of ATF (or even motor oil.) Or you could get real fancy and use two plastic baby bottles and considerably LESS than 7' of clear vinyl tubing. Neither one should set you back more than $10, if that.

My point being, you don't need to buy a sync tool if you don't want to.

 

Fitz, I'll have to really dig into those threads then man. I honestly have no idea what I'm looking at when I look at those tools lol. I know you'll blast me for that but I've never touched a bike engine until the first of July So far I feel pretty accomplished, but it's all a tad overwhelming. But fun nonetheless, thanks to you guys here. Hopefully I'll have her back on the road by this weekend. And maybe, just maybe build a manometer and sync her up too

 

pic may help you to understand sync screw vs pilot mixture screws

 

Thanks Five, that helps a bunch man!

I picked up my torch today from home depot. That thing has like a 7 inch flame, I really hope I don't ruin anything tomorrow. Gonna attempt to remove those pesky drain screws.... Here goes nothing

 

screw to board......heat up area around drain screw....use phillips to untighten hopefully......use a little olive oil...take your time.....it may take a few times....but should work......do all 4 need extracting or were you able to get a few loose......do not strip them or you will have to use a screw extractor to get them out.....replace with allen head drain bowl screws from Chacal....

Good luck

 

Allen head screws shipped today, along with half a million other things

Problem is, whoever was in these before me stripped them. There is very little I can latch on to and that's what worries me a lot. We'll see how it goes. can i hit the screws with brake cleaner to clear the gunk off the screws? shouldn't hard anything right?

Man I dunno if this is gonna work considering these screws are essentially stripped already, we'll see how it goes. All 4 need extracting.

 

Here is the link on baby bottle manometer......this is much cheaper than a Carbtune Pro which I bought from Chacal for about $155.....ouch plus a colortune from him...Ouch again....

http://www.xjbikes.com/Forums/viewtopic ... meter.html

 

Would you be so kind as to let a new guy borrow those? I'd pay shipping both ways, and I'll send back a nice six pack of local brews

I'll check out that link! Thank you, you've been a big help five

 

So syncing only involves the three big screws. THen you need a colortune to do the 4 pilot screws? If that's right, I 'think' I'm understanding this a little now.

 

I have not even used them yet myself......but I am about to in the near future.... I am getting close myself to fire this puppy up......getting anxious myself.....

kleraudio....be optimistic.....hopefully you can ride this weekend.....but if it doesn't happen....do not get disappointed....the more you know about your bike & how it functions.....the better off you will be down the road......you are on the right approach.......

Others here get disappointed & discourage & wind up selling their bike....they just don't see it all the way to the end.....

I can tell you this are great bikes when running properly......they will give you much enjoyment when there are screaming....it just takes patience when resurrecting from the dead....

 

DREMEL the damaged Head of the Drain Screw enough to allow you to place a Perfectly-centered ... Center Punch.

Drill the Screw progressively larger using sharp-as-new Drill Bits.
When you have a Drilled Hole --> LARGE <-- enough to accommodate the EZ-out ... it won't be --> DEEP <-- enough for the EZ-out to get enough Purchase.

You have to --> SHORTEN <-- the Business-end of the EZ-out to be successful.

Assistant.
Gloves.
HEAT! The Drain area. NOT the EZ-out.
After heating, ... Insert Ez-out in the remnant.
SEAT the EZ-out with a few taps so it gets a bite.

After the EZ-out is Seated.
Apply a SOCKET to the Flats on the EZ-out.
Use a Ratchet that can take a whack.
Apply significant Pre-undo Torque.

Arrange the angle of the Ratchet Handle to accept a smart blow with a Hard Wood Hammer Handle.

Give it a whack.
Cross your fingers.